Continued from here:
^ This is absolutely critical for men to know.
Maintaining Respect in Relationships - background
I am happily married now with a devoted, nurturing wife, but if I had gotten hitched in an earlier phase of my life without experience and red pill knowledge of women, seduction, relationships, frame, red/green flags, mental health etc... I may have been in for one long and hard ride. I've made many, many mistakes in the past, as I wasn't afraid to try and fail, however I'm far more confident now about mapping a realistic blue print for a satisfying relationship, especially between a conservative / Christian man and woman. That said, many of these principles apply to committed relationships regardless of philosophical or religious orientation.
The State of the Whipped
It is hard to get data on this but I'd say at least 80% of married guys in the modern West live completely under the thumb of their wives, and that only gets worse once kids are born - then I'd say over 95% get worn down into full submission. With kids, men will often feel like their needs come last, even if their wife respects them as a leader.
Women are masters at (largely subconscious) emotional blackmail and have fewer external and internal constraints on their emotional state. This means men have to be educated on handling emotional 'sh*t tests', calm assertion, self-control, etc. Women can sulk and whine and the man will not get repulsed. In fact he will often feel he needs to step in and save her (cue the annoyed nods from women who want emotional validation and not practical solutions to their often fixable problems). Contrast that with men who sulk, whine and cannot control their emotions... their relationships will not end well.
The Standard Process
A typical relationship process often looks like this, with 5 blended stages:
1. Man seeks woman -> woman fully in control.
2. Woman seeks commitment -> man mostly in control.
3. Man commits informally -> woman mostly in control again.
4. Man proposes, gets married, thus commits formally -> woman takes control.
5. Man makes irreversible commitment through kids -> woman assumes full and ongoing control.
Things don't always happen like this but I think it is a broadly accurate framework of a common process.
Emotional Damage and Control
The below skit by so-called "comedian" Ali Wong *groan* isn't funny, rather, it shows how the wife wearing the pants in marriage is the accepted norm in the mainstream.
^ if the link doesn't work for you, at around the 2 minute mark the crowd of women cheer wildly when the speaker bluntly praises women's emotional manipulation and abuse of their husbands to make their own man's life hell in order to satisfy their individual desires. It is unreal. Likewise, this is the norm now:
Unlike in more rationale times:
What does a 'Trad' woman demand and give? Does it change?
It's also important to acknowledge that many men have naive delusions about what a traditional woman will give and recieve. At the early stages she may cook and clean to please you. But do you know how much she will demand once you fully commit?
First, many women expect their husbands to literally do anything the wife asks them to do, because that is their duty. It's best to be realistic about the pros and cons of younger vs older women, independent vs dependent women, etc.
There are always trade-offs.
Second, once a woman knows the man is committed, and won't or can't leave, she may revert to her baseline level of low-effort homeostasis.
Choose Carefully
There are traditional women out there who actively seek to support their husband as per biblical docrine (e.g.
Ephesians 5:22–33) and/or who have a highly feminine, pleasant and agreeable nature.
The personality, mindset and faith of your wife will make a monumental difference to your quality of life. I cannot state this clearly enough:
it's better to be single forever than to select a wife who will not respect you. This is especially relevant in 2024 and beyond.
Setting the Frame as a Christian
That said, it doesn't matter if you and your wife are devoted to God, it is possible that you will become whipped over time unless you take a conscious decision, day after day, to take responsibility, be the leader, control your emotions, have a mission, etc. This is primarily due to the woman's biological imperative and is exacerbated by external influences such as social media, her friends, colleagues, and the broader culture.
I think it is a little naive to believe the principles of 'frame' don't apply because your current or future wife is or will be a traditional Christian woman. She is still a woman. In my direct observation of Catholic and Protestant circles -- which do vary hugely across denominations, countries etc -- there is little to no special privilege of reducing the need for responsibility and leadership that is granted to a man because he married a woman who believes in God.
Moreover, there are countless good-hearted Christian men of faith who are utterly naive about the nature of women and who think being nice and accommodating at all times is the righteous way to go.
This "nice guy" approach is doomed to fail given enough time, and in such cases a tutorial on frame and its importance can be a helpful nudge in the stronger direction.
Understanding Frame
This video by Orion Taraban explain the concept of 'frame' in more detail (this is a second video by Orion, created after the one posted earlier in the 'reaction to game' thread)
The Slow Drip of Melting Authority
Further, relationship frames are not 'set and forget'. You must continually maintain your leadership on a daily basis. There are no days off. This can feel like a huge burden to some men, and it gets many times harder with children. Still, it's essential, unless you don't mind playing second fiddle for the rest of your life, a guaranteed way to drain your energy, testosterone and self esteem.
Getting beaten down emotionally usually happens not by one swift blow, but by 1000 cuts. Thus being vigilant and not getting lazy is essential:
^ This video is not aimed at married Christians and I disagree with some aspects of this video such as 'spinning plates', however the fundamental concepts are useful for any man to know.
Four Key Steps
Thus in any longterm relationship the man, for the sake of his sanity, health, testosterone etc, would likely benefit from significant investment and consideration of all 4 of the following.
1. Building yourself up in advance, I.e. massive self development before meeting the woman, to become husband material.
2. Very careful screening and selection in the woman.
3. Setting expectations, boundaries etc from Day one.
4. Vigilant discipline and maintenance of your leadership.
Ideally by the time you are years deep into the relationship most of these behaviours are second nature and you have ascended through the four stages of competence:
Disclaimers: Maintaining Balance and Accepting Inevitable Risk
First, it is possible to become overly sensitive to the perception of 'frame' and start keeping track of who did what in the relationship. This isn't fun. When power dynamics are the primary lens through which the relationship is viewed, meaningful husband duties tend to feel like chores and resentment builds.
There is also a risk of alienating one's spouse when control is made the governing principle underlying the relationship dynamics. So, I have found it useful to grant my wife authority over certain domains at home and with children, as this gives her a feeling of autonomy and frees up my time to work on my career, health etc, which are critical for the functioning of not just me but the whole family. As part of this separation of duties, I directly discussed the utility of role specialisation in marriage, which helped her understand that 50/50 across all tasks is inefficient and in many cases, simply impossible.
Second, nothing is promised. All the planning, framing etc can go out the window because women and people change. Also external environments can change. When you have kids your world will change, and your relationship. And thus risk is inevitable. Yet fortune favours the brave.
Conclusion
By putting in the hard yards up front in (a) building up your own internal and external resources prior to meeting wifey (b) screening very, very hard, and (c) setting expectations from day one, you are doing your future self a huge, huge favour. Once the ring gets on the finger, and then the kids come, then the real work starts. Yet this is when most men get complacent and stop trying. But... you are not like most men, are you?
I hope you got some value from this. Feedback welcome as always.
