Rise of the DINKs (Final Civ Death Stage)

[Cuchulainn]

If ageing was pre-programmed it would be very easy to solve, but it's not. It's not a matter of opinion, there's experiments with millions of (ageing) fruit-flies where you can 10x the average starting lifespan by just postponing the age of reproduction. This means that the genes/epigenetic phenotypes for longevity are chosen and life span will gradually increase, with no upper limit. Ageing is completely malleable in other words.

Actually aging is kind off preprogrammed.

Your DNA strands have a little end cap on them, and as you age, these degrade, allowing the DNA strand to decay.

Think of them like a shoelace, with the little plastic bits on the end keeping it together.

Everyones shoelace unravels at a different pace, but if we could just keep the end cap together it would be great.

But we cant do it for shoelaces let alone DNA yet.

 

[GodfatherPartTwo]

God made careers for the family, not the family for the careers. Liberals got it backwards once again.

 

[Blade Runner]

Actually aging is kind off preprogrammed.

Your DNA strands have a little end cap on them, and as you age, these degrade, allowing the DNA strand to decay.

Think of them like a shoelace, with the little plastic bits on the end keeping it together.

Everyones shoelace unravels at a different pace, but if we could just keep the end cap together it would be great.
Jo
But we cant do it for shoelaces let alone DNA yet.

Yes, but even telomere length isn't a particularly good predictor. Heart rate is an interesting one. We could go on. I know Johnny objects, but there are many theories as to why programming makes sense also from an ecology point of view. Even a community one.

 

[Cuchulainn]

Yes, but even telomere length isn't a particularly good predictor. Heart rate is an interesting one. We could go on. I know Johnny objects, but there are many theories as to why programming makes sense also from an ecology point of view. Even a community one.

I wouldnt say programmed, I would say everyone has a shelf life and a best before date. Those will be somewhat predetermined by a number of factors such as genetic health and environmental factors while in the womb.

Once born, you can probably only maintain that bodies best before date. Anything unhealthy you do will lower it. I doubt you could extend it very far by being super healthy.

 

[Blade Runner]

I wouldnt say programmed, I would say everyone has a shelf life and a best before date. Those will be somewhat predetermined by a number of factors such as genetic health and environmental factors while in the womb.

Once born, you can probably only maintain that bodies best before date. Anything unhealthy you do will lower it. I doubt you could extend it very far by being super healthy.

Yes, in general, we are in agreement. Unless it's beyond a crazy threshold, I don't even think you can end up lowering all that much, but you will notice that your quality can dramatically lower (reason enough to not do many unhealthy things, or at least risk assess them). I also agree with you that you can't extend it all that long either, but I reserve the right to change this opinion as I do think one of the promising things a group with really good insights has that possibility. Even if that ends up as just improving the quality of the composition of the cells, I would welcome it. Who wants to live much beyond late 80s or 90s anyway? I don't.

 

[Cuchulainn]

Yes, in general, we are in agreement. Unless it's beyond a crazy threshold, I don't even think you can end up lowering all that much, but you will notice that your quality can dramatically lower (reason enough to not do many unhealthy things, or at least risk assess them). I also agree with you that you can't extend it all that long either, but I reserve the right to change this opinion as I do think one of the promising things a group with really good insights has that possibility. Even if that ends up as just improving the quality of the composition of the cells, I would welcome it. Who wants to live much beyond late 80s or 90s anyway? I don't.

That's why I said shelf life and best before date. There is a period when food is at its best (shelf life) and looks good when displayed in a store, then there is a period when it's edible but not fit to see in the store.

I think we can increase and decrease our shelf life by a small but not insignificant amount by things such as our diet, exercise, stress levels etc.

But it will require some science to increase our peak period of health up to the final part of our life span (80s to 90s).

To increase our maximum life span will require some serious science, and who knows what that investment will achieve.

There is no point increasing our life span to live an extra 10-20 years as a senile, wheelchair bound old geezer. I would rather life to 80-90 with the guaranteed vitality of a healthy 30-50 yr old.

 

[Johnnyvee]

No, it is somewhat malleable in non-human species. You keep applying other beings to the same realities as humans, which is weird since we've pointed out how these are not necessarily related. It's like David Sinclair talking about how Blue Whales live hundreds of years so humans can too. Uhh, no.

It's the same mechanism in all ageing species, which are species that have sexual reproduction in general. This is well proven as I said. Humans have the ageing pattern we have since we share a common genetic heritage. But ageing stops in very late life, and we can stop it sooner with an ancestral diet and lifestyle. (paleo) If you claim that "ageing is pre-programmed" and I show you an ageing species where you can easily 2-10x the lifespan (or the other way even) you should concede that this is false I think.

This "paleo" approach has never been done before, as you also need the good parts of modernity/medicine to maintain health. The reason Jeanne Calment's 121 record still stands is really a testament to the dreadful effects of the industrial diet and lifestyle. As the strict paleo folks age this record will be beaten no doubt, even without the ageing reversal drugs that will eventually come along as a result of the combination of -omics and AI under the correct ageing theory umbrella.

 

[Johnnyvee]

Actually aging is kind off preprogrammed.

Your DNA strands have a little end cap on them, and as you age, these degrade, allowing the DNA strand to decay.

Think of them like a shoelace, with the little plastic bits on the end keeping it together.

Everyones shoelace unravels at a different pace, but if we could just keep the end cap together it would be great.

But we cant do it for shoelaces let alone DNA yet.

I don't blame you for thinking that, I belive you got the idea from me in fact, as I wrote a long article on that on the forum way back in the day. (The telomeres/Bill Andrews deal, you might find it in the RVF archive) But it's wrong unfortunately! Had it only been that simple.

 

[Blade Runner]

If you claim that "ageing is pre-programmed" and I show you an ageing species where you can easily 2-10x the lifespan (or the other way even) you should concede that this is false I think.

This is your problem. One cannot extrapolate things from other species and apply them to humans with certainty. Your approach to this topic is far closer to certainty than it is "Let's see what happens" which is why from a scientific point of view, you are incorrect. There are many reasons why this is, such as the theory of large numbers, which has to do with maturation of species, etc.

We are different than every other animal for numerous reasons. Our development is FAR more complex, it's a joke to even have to bring this up.

 

[Johnnyvee]

This is your problem. One cannot extrapolate things from other species and apply them to humans with certainty. Your approach to this topic is far closer to certainty than it is "Let's see what happens" which is why from a scientific point of view, you are incorrect. There are many reasons why this is, such as the theory of large numbers, which has to do with maturation of species, etc.

We are different than every other animal for numerous reasons. Our development is FAR more complex, it's a joke to even have to bring this up.

All ageing species have the same pattern. It's a first principle of biology that applies to all sexually producing species. It's more of a mathematical thing really, like gravity. You can in fact infer that from fruit-fly data and prove it with solid science. Most of science relies on inferences anyway...

We are different in many aspects, but not in others. Ageing, cancer etc. are equivalent in pretty much all species that we share genetic ties with. There are not 1, 7 or 9 causes of ageing in any ageing species. Rather there are 1000's of genes and even more transcripts involved, all interconnected as well. It's more in humans yes, but the basic mechanism is just the same in what is now called the pleiotropic network model. Here's what it looks like in fruit-flies, and you're right that it's much more complex in humans per se...

 

[Blade Runner]

I personally think max living for the human being at this point is 120-130. What I actually desire is a few of the treatments that I see promise in that are more akin to rejuvenation rather than longevity, which I largely see as an idol. I'd rather live as a 50-65 year old with treatments that made me closer in physical function or appearance, to around the 30s, if I could. That is far better than just living until 90 or some such nonsense. I'm a little bit biased, though, since most of the older people I know don't do much or are pretty boring due to their longevity increases being after a time in which life was normal but largely just work based, for them. Also, if you can't get boners into your 60s, there isn't much point anyway (as a funny proxy, I like to say that).

 

[Thomas More]

I personally think max living for the human being at this point is 120-130. What I actually desire is a few of the treatments that I see promise in that are more akin to rejuvenation rather than longevity, which I largely see as an idol. I'd rather live as a 50-65 year old with treatments that made me closer in physical function or appearance, to around the 30s, if I could. That is far better than just living until 90 or some such nonsense. I'm a little bit biased, though, since most of the older people I know don't do much or are pretty boring due to their longevity increases being after a time in which life was normal but largely just work based, for them. Also, if you can't get boners into your 60s, there isn't much point anyway (as a funny proxy, I like to say that).

Age does take its toll in the 50s, and I assume I will see even more of that in my 60s. However, I think with exercise and diet and general healthy living, it is already pretty feasible to maintain a good level of energy into your 60s. In particular, one can definitely still get boners into one's 60s.

I'm not as energetic as I wish I was, but I can see that it's due to my own failures in diet, fitness, and lifestyle. I'm still not that bad off, and I definitely see the benefits when I muster the self-disciple to do better.

I'm really hoping I can stay energetic into my 70s and 80s. I have known people that did so, and of course I have known people that were already a wreck in their late 60s. I am very much in favor of medical science that maximizes one's level of vigor in old age, and I think we will continue to see progress in this area. I really don't expect to see significant increases in actual life span.

 

[Samseau]

The talk of aging is off-topic and fundamentally cope to the point of this thread:

We're gonna die, and we either have children, or we devote our lives to the Church, otherwise our history, culture, and faith dies with us. Simple as that, there is no other way to escape this.

 

[Sabonis73]

He’s talking about mimetic theory and it is the single best solution to the birth rate decline.

Women mimic one another. This is due to their innate appeal to social consensus. You often see this reflective in fashion and social trends (think TikTok dances, Ugg boots and Pumpkin Spice lattes every fall.) Or even in politics with the recent Kambala brat slop.

The same is true with having babies. “Baby fever” is a term that exists for a reason. It’s the natural mimetic desire of women to want and have what other women around them want and have. God beautifully designed women this way for a reason and our enemies have capitalized and weaponized this memetic desire to enrich themselves and destroy our people at the same time. As per usual Satan and his children take what God has designed for good and invert it for evil.

For thousands of years the natural mimetic desires of women were: a husband, a loving family, and children. Only in the last 80 years have those natural mimetic desires been usurped by fake and vapid ones like “freedom” (wage/sex slavery) and “stuff.” This of course is thanks to decades of endless propaganda and policies enacted by our enemies.

The birth rate decline can be solved very easily: seize control of the media and culture from our enemies. Pump the normies with pro-natalist content. Champion parenthood and make motherhood our society’s most sacred and highest honor vocation for women.

The birth rate will skyrocket overnight. Since we can’t—or won’t—do this right now the second best option is to lead by example.

Baby fever is VERY real as any honest woman will tell you. If all the women in your wife’s friend group are having babies she will want a baby, but someone has to be the first to start the chain reaction. We see this constantly in Church. There are literal baby boom years. But someone must be the first. Be that first. Then keep doing it. Lead by example and create a chain reaction of mimetic desire.

 

[Batman]

I wasn't sure where to post this, but, we shouldn't criticize women who don't want kids.


This is the alternative:

 

[GoodShepherd]

My wife and I are DINKs. We did not choose this for ourselves. We were in the same kindergarten class. We started dating in high school. In college, we got engaged. We both went into teaching so we could have the summers off with our children. My wife could not get pregnant. I became very angry with God. It took its toll on our marriage. After some time, we just began to cope by basically living the lifestyles of many of the DINKs in these videos. We traveled, bought expensive things, went to nice restaurants, got a couple of dogs, etc.

On the surface, people assume that we have chosen this for ourselves. I think we need to show more grace to some of these couples. Many of them may be coping from infertility issues.

Im sorry to hear that you guys cant have kids, so you are not one of these selfish people as you actually desired children and mourned that God didnt bless you with kids, I heard Jay Dyer is in the same boat.

 

[GoodShepherd]

To understand the DINK phenomenon, just watch the vid below:



Dual-income no kids movement. Anyone know some DINKs? I feel like I know and have seen quite a few DINKs, even though I do not actively seek such people out. They are everywhere, and they are highly disturbing people despite generally being nice people overall. They are incredibly selfish and shortsighted.

I even know a Billionaire DINK, and many other rich DINKs. Why have so much income and not have a single child? It's completely demonic.

I've also dated women, back in the day, who told me on Date #1 they never wanted children, but wanted marriage. I would ask them, "But your biological imperative compels you to reproduce," to which the girl would reply, "No biological imperative here." So then I announced, "Well, I'd like children, but I don't want marriage," and I never called her again.

But for whatever reason, there is some kind of strong demonic force that actually makes people hoard as many resources as possible, even get married, and then do nothing except pleasure themselves. From the man's perspective, if one is going to be that selfish, why even get married? From the woman's perspective, I suppose it make some kind of sense. Marriage without children is probably the ultimate goal of a selfish woman.

Regardless, what are other member's experiences with DINKs?

This seems to be a growing trend all over the world, I have met many young couples in South Africa who also seem to be adopting this view they openly told me.

It seems to be happening to people who are very educated, modern and wealthy, Iv also noticed a decline in marriage.

In my personaly experience kids help hold the marriage together, my wife and I would have probably got divorced if there werent kids holding us together, the childrens needs had to be put first before our own and for us to remain together was more important to the kids needs.

 

[Douglas Quaid]

Yeah I don't see the point of getting married if you don't want kids. A big exception would be if you can't physically have kids.

 

[Blade Runner]

Torba is correct. I've heard women say this in interviews, which depended of course on their locale as well. That was in the late 2000s last, though, incidentally.

Has anyone noticed that Thiel is like Musk in that being smart it's amazing how stuttering and stammering they are? Sometimes Musk is unlistenable and I can't even believe he's smart it gets so bad. It's like a combination between unintelligible and mushmouth followed by a hope for something smart to come out.

 

[Blade Runner]

This seems to be a growing trend all over the world, I have met many young couples in South Africa who also seem to be adopting this view they openly told me.

It seems to be happening to people who are very educated, modern and wealthy, Iv also noticed a decline in marriage.

In my personaly experience kids help hold the marriage together, my wife and I would have probably got divorced if there werent kids holding us together, the childrens needs had to be put first before our own and for us to remain together was more important to the kids needs.

I don't have a ton of encounters with DINKs, but the ones I have met were very stereotypical thus informative. What I found:

• The woman was mid, and I presumed she was older when married, which of course had much to do with the story and eventuality of not having kids.
• The guy was the type that would try to marry an older woman because she was attractive enough, and it secured sex, he had money but was otherwise mid himself, at best.
• They tended to be a nonsensical mix of religions (like Christian-Jew) and/or not religious.
• They were nice mostly because they were fairly normal, but more that they were rich and unstressed, generally speaking. Maybe it was because they were career people who liked work which meant less stress and a guarantee of money, and of course no kids.

The reason why I personally don't really care, except I feel they are missing out (I do agree, why get married?) is because this kind of thing only happens in spoiled societies that in some ways need messages of decline and don't need their kids. The tragedy is the people who would have kids otherwise and are above these in many ways, but get crowded out or expect too much due to being a cut above. I suspect that the woman in the DINKs just loves resources a ton and is (what I consider) old, marries the guy, and doesn't really want kids with him anyway, so that seals it.