I also just want to point out for anyone who is not paying attention that the chart showing the average number of eggs is a logarithmic chart. So even though the decline from age 12 to age 32 does not look like much in the graph when you look at the numbers in brackets you can see it has declined from 300,000 - 500,000 at age 12 to 120,000 at age 32. So that is a decline of between 60% and 76% in egg count.
So peak fertility is at 24, 11-12 years after pregnancy begins and when the eggs have drastically declined?
And I really don't agree with the chart creator's bias writing "optimal fertility" 18-31. I don't interpret the information this way.
On average, late teens is peak fertility because the reproductive organs are fully materialized and egg count is also higher.
@starlight I agree this is lame to have to communicate this way. Perhaps you can lead the charge on a "Destruction of Modern Men" thread and make it a women's thread? Lol.
@starlight one last thing for now. I didn't say they should get pregnant at first period. I just shared the information regarding the fact that they are able to. Keep in mind also that when I share things, it also doesn't mean I agree with everything written or charted. It's only to use as a reference.
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Peak Fertility For Women and Men
- Thread starter TrainedLogosmotion
- Start date
What happens to all the eggs from birth to puberty? Over half of them just ... dissappear?
Generally, the first year after the beginning of menstruation is anovulatory with one, maybe two, cycles and increases in frequency and regularity from that starting point which is why the first few years after the beginning of menstruation are not considered the most fertile. (If fertility is from conceptions, and conceptions are from ovulations, fewer ovulations would mean fewer chances of conceptions and lower fertility, logically anyway.)
They degrade over time and are eliminated or reabsorbed because they are essentially just eggs dying off... didn't pass the fitness test, in other words.
Just to add, thousands of eggs are released each cycle, however only one (and rarely two (fraternal twins)) is "chosen" (I'm simplifying here) to reach maturity where it can be fertilized. The rest degrade and are either eliminated from or reabsorbed into the body.
I have to say (and this isn't directly at you @Rax Moscow but generally speaking) that I am quite surprised that there is such a focus on the importance of "female fertility," when clearly, at least in this thread, very few seem to know basic female reproductive development and systems.
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Here's a real rabbit hole for those that are interested: the effects of paracetamol (aka acetaminophen, Tylenol) on the fertility of unborn children. There were two studies that I read years ago (I'll try to find them) that showed maternal consumption of "Tylenol" for an extended period of time permanently decreased the amount of eggs and sperm in the next generation by *half.* The granddaughters also had reduced egg count.
Edit: For reference, in the US, Tylenol is touted as a "pregnancy safe" medicine.
Edit: For reference, in the US, Tylenol is touted as a "pregnancy safe" medicine.
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In the modern world everything poisons you. You almost have to live like the Amish to be healthy in this day and age.
If we're honest, the fertility disinformation comes up because women don't like the reality you quoted.
Teen Marriages Are a Good Thing, Especially Christian Ones - Traditional Russian Wisdom
Historically, most Russians married in their teens, and almost always with the consent and blessing of their parents. Modern experts in Russia are coming to understand the wisdom in this approach . . .This article from our archives was first published on RI in July 2020
Joshua DavidsonNov 10, 2022 | 1200 words 4,285 Comments
MORE:FAMILY VALUES
Are teenage marriages a good thing? Or is it usually better to wait? When American author and clergy-wife Fredricka Mathewes-Greendiscussed the question, she famously concluded, "Let's Have More Teen Pregnancy". Dr. Svetlana Nazina, a teacher and psychologist from the Tula region of Russia, offers similar advice.
The Russian Patriarch's Commission for the Family recently published an interview with Dr. Nazina, where she was asked about the optimum age for getting married:
Dr. Nazina responded with these words of traditional wisdom:
Children grow quickly, just a few more years and they will become moms and dads. Parents of adolescents are worried in advance: When are their children better off marrying and getting married — early, or at a more mature age? What marriages are considered "early" today? And which families are the most viable?
I cannot agree with those who say that young people are not ready for an early marriage. Everything depends on the individual . . . . I am in solidarity with many, recognizing that the modern generation has serious problems in their thoughts about marriage. Indeed, psychologists and sociologists today are concerned about the abnormal immaturity of young people, and their lack of motivation to create a family.
In Russia, how was it historically? The girl was prepared for family life from birth. The parents collected her dowry for a long time: they put bed linens, dishes, various household items, and ornaments into special chests for safe keeping. Beginning around the age of 10 or 11, the girl began to actively participate as well.
By doing this, they were not only preparing for the girl's success materially — they were also instilling the proper spirit and attitude within her. They were properly setting her expectations, mentally preparing her for a good marriage, a happy family, and the birth of future children.
Russian people also had good experience with how to raise a family man. A young man in the 17th century was not allowed to marry until he was ready to provide for his family.
But what happens today? Sadly, a lot of people just do not believe it is possible to get married, stay married, and live happily together until old age.
And, it seems to me, the root of the problem is in modern society, because it implants false and dangerous attitudes within our children.
For example, consider the principle of "success and recognition" that is almost universally implemented in families today. From childhood our children are being taught to focus on certain types of outward achievement, which are not necessarily family oriented. Starting from kindergarten, they are taught to be the best, to extol their smallest successes, to collect a portfolio, to keep a diary of achievements, to be proud of their grades, and to hang medals and certificates in a prominent place. But with these little things, goal-setting begins.
And if the emphasis in the children's value system is shifted to career, money, recognition and success, then why are we surprised when our children begin to implement the same principles in their adult years? They decide to "take everything they can get from life", they demand everything that is expensive and the "best", and they are driven to achieve their materialistic goals by whatever means necessary. Meanwhile, the difficulties of raising a family will only be considered a "hindrance" to their ambitions, so they put off marriage until later. Alas, it is our own fault that they have such ambitions, because of how we raised them.
And yet, even today, young people under the age of 25 do create families. And they are not exceptional. So we should not overly criticize the new generation. Among today's youth, there are wonderful boys and girls. There are young people who have thoughtful, deep, rich inner lives. These are young people who are quite mature individuals, ready to take responsibility for themselves. They are willing to cooperate with others, to show patience, and to sacrifice. Of course, this especially applies to those who are actively involved in Church life.
It seems to me, for those who are brought up in Orthodox Christian traditions, early marriage is a lifesaver. A couple who marries early and cherishes their relationship, will live clean and free, not weighed down with the emotional baggage that results from years of wayward thoughts and deeds. But there are fewer such people today. Sadly, the rust of permissiveness has penetrated into many aspects of modern culture.
It is unfortunate that many modern youth are avoiding early marriages. But in my opinion, this is not the most serious problem.
A much bigger problem is the trend towards abnormally late marriage. When a person is 30-40 years old, he finally understands — it is time to come to his senses, settle down, and start a family. But by that age, it is very difficult to find any good marriage partners — the best men and women have already gotten married, and are no longer available.
As a psychologist, as a wife, and as a mother of children, I am convinced that a young boy or girl is primarily brought up by a family, not primarily by society. So preparing them for marriage is not the school's job — it is a job for their own home environment. To protect them from the ills of society, good immunity is important — they need a good example set by parents, relatives, and older siblings.
As a rule, when the parents' attention is focused on the upbringing of future fathers and mothers, then the children will be ready for early marriage. Marriage readiness is not determined by a person's outward age. What matters is the inner age of an individual.
And who is able to determine whether a young couple is ready to get married? Traditionally, regardless of the age of the children, the consent and blessing of the parents was decisive.
Of course, what the modern culture calls an "early" marriage (age 18 to 25), did not used to be considered "early". In the eighteenth century, Russian brides were as young as 13, and bridegrooms could be age 15. Then in the year 1830, by decree of the emperor, the marriage age was increased to 16 and 18 years, respectively.
Interestingly, parents often appealed to the authorities for permission to let younger girls marry. In such cases, a priest would examine the future bride, to see if she was properly prepared to be a wife and mother. If the priest gave his blessing, then the wedding was allowed to take place.
During this period of time, a 23-25 year old bride was considered "old" and undesirable. By the time they were in their mid-twenties, most women were already married, with several children.
Yet today some women wait to have children until they are 28, or even 30 — nearing the time when the female reproductive system is beginning to fail. This results in miscarriages, infertility, children with Downs Syndrome, and other pathologies.
One cannot help considering the fact that our ancestors knew more about life, and delved deeper into the nature of things, than most modern people do.
Oh my goodness! I have read before that Tylenol use during pregnancy (and even in infants) was correlated to increased autism. Some theories are that babies get multiple sh0ts and then the glutathione antioxidant is used up to break down the Tylenol (used for teething) and isn’t available to process the toxins from said sh0ts. I haven’t take any OTC meds in like 3 years because of this and pregnancies. They came out with another CDC BS study to discredit earlier research but I still won’t risk it. Thank you for sharing this
AussieJack
Protestant
Teen Marriages Are a Good Thing, Especially Christian Ones - Traditional Russian Wisdom
Historically, most Russians married in their teens, and almost always with the consent and blessing of their parents. Modern experts in Russia are coming to understand the wisdom in this approach . . .
This article from our archives was first published on RI in July 2020
Joshua DavidsonNov 10, 2022 | 1200 words 4,285 Comments
MORE:FAMILY VALUES
Are teenage marriages a good thing? Or is it usually better to wait? When American author and clergy-wife Fredricka Mathewes-Greendiscussed the question, she famously concluded, "Let's Have More Teen Pregnancy". Dr. Svetlana Nazina, a teacher and psychologist from the Tula region of Russia, offers similar advice.
The Russian Patriarch's Commission for the Family recently published an interview with Dr. Nazina, where she was asked about the optimum age for getting married:
Dr. Nazina responded with these words of traditional wisdom:
Dr. Svetlana Nazina — Teacher / Psychologist
I cannot agree with those who say that young people are not ready for an early marriage. Everything depends on the individual . . . . I am in solidarity with many, recognizing that the modern generation has serious problems in their thoughts about marriage. Indeed, psychologists and sociologists today are concerned about the abnormal immaturity of young people, and their lack of motivation to create a family.
In Russia, how was it historically? The girl was prepared for family life from birth. The parents collected her dowry for a long time: they put bed linens, dishes, various household items, and ornaments into special chests for safe keeping. Beginning around the age of 10 or 11, the girl began to actively participate as well.
By doing this, they were not only preparing for the girl's success materially — they were also instilling the proper spirit and attitude within her. They were properly setting her expectations, mentally preparing her for a good marriage, a happy family, and the birth of future children.
Russian people also had good experience with how to raise a family man. A young man in the 17th century was not allowed to marry until he was ready to provide for his family.
But what happens today? Sadly, a lot of people just do not believe it is possible to get married, stay married, and live happily together until old age.
And, it seems to me, the root of the problem is in modern society, because it implants false and dangerous attitudes within our children.
For example, consider the principle of "success and recognition" that is almost universally implemented in families today. From childhood our children are being taught to focus on certain types of outward achievement, which are not necessarily family oriented. Starting from kindergarten, they are taught to be the best, to extol their smallest successes, to collect a portfolio, to keep a diary of achievements, to be proud of their grades, and to hang medals and certificates in a prominent place. But with these little things, goal-setting begins.
And if the emphasis in the children's value system is shifted to career, money, recognition and success, then why are we surprised when our children begin to implement the same principles in their adult years? They decide to "take everything they can get from life", they demand everything that is expensive and the "best", and they are driven to achieve their materialistic goals by whatever means necessary. Meanwhile, the difficulties of raising a family will only be considered a "hindrance" to their ambitions, so they put off marriage until later. Alas, it is our own fault that they have such ambitions, because of how we raised them.
And yet, even today, young people under the age of 25 do create families. And they are not exceptional. So we should not overly criticize the new generation. Among today's youth, there are wonderful boys and girls. There are young people who have thoughtful, deep, rich inner lives. These are young people who are quite mature individuals, ready to take responsibility for themselves. They are willing to cooperate with others, to show patience, and to sacrifice. Of course, this especially applies to those who are actively involved in Church life.
It seems to me, for those who are brought up in Orthodox Christian traditions, early marriage is a lifesaver. A couple who marries early and cherishes their relationship, will live clean and free, not weighed down with the emotional baggage that results from years of wayward thoughts and deeds. But there are fewer such people today. Sadly, the rust of permissiveness has penetrated into many aspects of modern culture.
It is unfortunate that many modern youth are avoiding early marriages. But in my opinion, this is not the most serious problem.
A much bigger problem is the trend towards abnormally late marriage. When a person is 30-40 years old, he finally understands — it is time to come to his senses, settle down, and start a family. But by that age, it is very difficult to find any good marriage partners — the best men and women have already gotten married, and are no longer available.
As a psychologist, as a wife, and as a mother of children, I am convinced that a young boy or girl is primarily brought up by a family, not primarily by society. So preparing them for marriage is not the school's job — it is a job for their own home environment. To protect them from the ills of society, good immunity is important — they need a good example set by parents, relatives, and older siblings.
As a rule, when the parents' attention is focused on the upbringing of future fathers and mothers, then the children will be ready for early marriage. Marriage readiness is not determined by a person's outward age. What matters is the inner age of an individual.
And who is able to determine whether a young couple is ready to get married? Traditionally, regardless of the age of the children, the consent and blessing of the parents was decisive.
Of course, what the modern culture calls an "early" marriage (age 18 to 25), did not used to be considered "early". In the eighteenth century, Russian brides were as young as 13, and bridegrooms could be age 15. Then in the year 1830, by decree of the emperor, the marriage age was increased to 16 and 18 years, respectively.
Interestingly, parents often appealed to the authorities for permission to let younger girls marry. In such cases, a priest would examine the future bride, to see if she was properly prepared to be a wife and mother. If the priest gave his blessing, then the wedding was allowed to take place.
During this period of time, a 23-25 year old bride was considered "old" and undesirable. By the time they were in their mid-twenties, most women were already married, with several children.
Yet today some women wait to have children until they are 28, or even 30 — nearing the time when the female reproductive system is beginning to fail. This results in miscarriages, infertility, children with Downs Syndrome, and other pathologies.
One cannot help considering the fact that our ancestors knew more about life, and delved deeper into the nature of things, than most modern people do.
This is an idiotic post and irrelevant to the men here who seem mostly older and looking for wives. Bitch get out of here.
You don't need to be calling the female members of this forum Bitches dude. You are the one who needs to leave.
It’s relevant to this thread topic, is it not? And it’s relevant to men and woman who have paired up and are raising their children to do better. Finding a wife is just the beginning!
Not only that, but Tylenol combined with vaccines is the most likely cause of autism. Some people blame the vaccines themselves (and the efficacy of vaccines is a separate issue, as is the safety of the preservatives and chemicals added to them), but vaccines alone do not cause the rampant rates of autism that we have seen since 1980. Cuba vaccinates its infants with essentially (or did until recently--we have added a bunch of crazy ones) the same innoculations that the US does. But Cuba specifically warns mothers to avoid Tylenol use for months afterwards.
The US uses the same vaccines, but encourages Tylenol consumption. This combination causes some type of reaction that creates double digit autism rates. Credit to Dr. John Gray (Men are from Mars, Women are From Venus) for first introducing me to this idea years ago.
Loading…
pages.ucsd.edu
Around 1980,” Pangborn stated, “all this be-
gan to change. The total frequency of occurrence dou-
bled, doubled again, and by 1995 was approximately
10 times that of 1980. Furthermore, while the onset-
at-birth type had increased 3 to 4 times, the onset-at-
18-months type had skyrocketed to considerably more
than 10 times its 1980 level.” Pangborn concluded that
most of the autistic population now appeared to have
“an acquired disease caused by something that we were
not doing 20 years ago.”
The 1980s was also the decade when acetaminophen
largely replaced aspirin for infants and young children.
There was also a brief period where mothers stopped giving infants Tylenol, due to a scare about poisoning (someone died when a bottle was laced with cyanide). During this brief period, autism rates dropped:
In autumn of 1982 seven people died after ingest-
ing Tylenol capsules laced with cyanide; in 1986 one
person died after ingesting Tylenol capsules similarly
tampered with. These events precipitated sharp declines
in nationwide sales of acetaminophen, accompanied by
declines in the numbers of California children with au-
tistic disorders born in 1984 and 1987
Even the groups that try to thought-control this as a conspiracy theory admit there is evidence of a link between the two:
Limited Evidence of a Link Between Acetaminophen and Autism or ADHD - FactCheck.org
Q: Is the use of acetaminophen during pregnancy linked to autism or ADHD? A: There is currently no strong evidence that acetaminophen use during pregnancy causes autism or ADHD in children. Expert groups continue to recommend use of the drug during pregnancy when necessary and in consultation...
www.factcheck.org
but
Also, for those that think America has historically had people marrying in their mid 20s or later, this is not true. Throughout all of American history, until 1980, the average age for first marriage ranged from 20 to 22. That's a very tight range. And if you look at charts going back 100 years earlier, you find the same. 20-22 was the average age for first marriage (and what does average mean? Some were marrying at 14, and others at 26, so marriages could have ranged equally throughout those years, but 20-22 was the mathematical mean).
Just think about that: Through our entire history, 22 was the highest this number ever got.
Historical marriage records kept by churches going back hundreds of years support this age range as well.
I don't think they were focused on fertility, but more on love; after girls turned 16 fathers would allow their daughters to be courted. By the time they were 20-22 they had found a young man they wanted to marry. So it would be roughly 4-6 years of "dating" men and then they would be in love.
The fertility was just an afterthought; a young woman is a young woman.
Yeah, and I think this goes well with what @TheLearningWife posted from Dr. Nazina. "Peak fertility" isn't exactly the same as "average age of marriage" but I don't think it's any coincidence that the two topics overlap (as in, the historical average age of marriage for women also coincides with their most fertile years) and past societies understood this to some degree. I'd like to think most people still do understand this in a more primitive/instinctual way which is why there has to be so much propaganda against early family formation and encouraging prolonged adolescence, along with other deterrents like forced education for teens instead of apprenticeships, etc.
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Here's Dr John Gray discussing low glutathione levels related to Tylenol causing autism around 29:00
"Normal dose of Tylenol inhibits glutathione production."
The US National Institute of Health has done studies suggesting that children who develop autism benefit from glutathione supplements (of course this is after the horse has left the barn):
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
"Normal dose of Tylenol inhibits glutathione production."
The US National Institute of Health has done studies suggesting that children who develop autism benefit from glutathione supplements (of course this is after the horse has left the barn):
A clinical trial of glutathione supplementation in autism spectrum disorders
Recent evidence shows that subjects diagnosed with an autism spectrum disorder (ASD) have significantly lower levels of glutathione than typically developing children. The purpose of this study was to examine the use of two commonly used glutathione supplements ...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
Here's Dr John Gray discussing low glutathione levels related to Tylenol causing autism around 29:00
"Normal dose of Tylenol inhibits glutathione production."
The US National Institute of Health has done studies suggesting that children who develop autism benefit from glutathione supplements (of course this is after the horse has left the barn):
A clinical trial of glutathione supplementation in autism spectrum disorders
Recent evidence shows that subjects diagnosed with an autism spectrum disorder (ASD) have significantly lower levels of glutathione than typically developing children. The purpose of this study was to examine the use of two commonly used glutathione supplements ...
And why would such a harmful drug be allowed over the counter to the general public? Or even any proven harmful products? Who was it that said something like, "The government wants you dead and your kids sick/retarded. Once you realize that, all of their actions make perfect sense." (Completely paraphrased here from an old memory, was it a Sam Hyde quote?)