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Game-like tactics for Christian Relationships?

I really dont know how to phrase this and it's really hard to say this in text with no context but I have a question that's been bothering me. I know it may come off as judgemental but it's not meant to be.

Should men settle for something less than "ideal"?
I'm wondering this too. There's a nice and very attractive girl I've been getting to know, and it's obvious that she's interested. She is even putting in a lot of effort to make it obvious.

But she's not that really feminine church girl we all envision. She goes to church, but skips a lot to hang out with her family that I'm assuming don't go to church. She acts feminine, but doesn't dress as well or make as much of an effort as the other women.

This probably sounds stupid, but I have this idea of getting some hot, virgin blonde that wears a dress and always goes to church. Maybe I need to get that idea out of my head and give this girl a chance. It's nice when a woman looks at you with that admiration in their eyes, and she does every time we talk. I also think she would follow my lead and make some changes.

But I will continue to talk to the blondes too 😄
 
I'm wondering this too. There's a nice and very attractive girl I've been getting to know, and it's obvious that she's interested. She is even putting in a lot of effort to make it obvious.

But she's not that really feminine church girl we all envision. She goes to church, but skips a lot to hang out with her family that I'm assuming don't go to church. She acts feminine, but doesn't dress as well or make as much of an effort as the other women.

This probably sounds stupid, but I have this idea of getting some hot, virgin blonde that wears a dress and always goes to church. Maybe I need to get that idea out of my head and give this girl a chance. It's nice when a woman looks at you with that admiration in their eyes, and she does every time we talk. I also think she would follow my lead and make some changes.

But I will continue to talk to the blondes too 😄
A lot of American guys would kill to have a nice, attractive, feminine girl pursuing them. The hot virgin blonde idea has a lot of glamour attached to it, but once the allure wears off would that ideal girl really be that great as you have it in your head? Because every time I've idealized something and pursued it to finally attain it, I always ask in the end "what was the big deal?"

This girl's spending time with family, not dating 20 dudes on tinder. It's something you can work with and lead her. And those women who are always dressed to the nines are ultra high maintenance and you'll be waiting hours everytime you want to go out. There are advantages to the more casual style.
 
I really dont know how to phrase this and it's really hard to say this in text with no context but I have a question that's been bothering me. I know it may come off as judgmental but it's not meant to be.

Should men settle for something less than "ideal"?
I have definitely ended up with less than "ideal" in my life. I think this is an unavoidable outcome. I think one must settle for the best they can get, which will absolutely be less than ideal. If you hold out for ideal, you might end up with nothing instead.

Look at the situation with women. Don't we all agree they think they are going to end up with a tall, rich, famous, handsome, billionaire. Don't women need to set their sights lower and accept the kind of man that realistically would be a match for them?

How could it be any different for men?
 
I bet you are in a kind of similar situation like me since you are Orthodox, and it will be hard to meet Orthodox women since Orthodox people are ultra minority in most cases.
This is a general problem for the West and those raised in it. Some of the luckiest are protestant converts to EO, but then you actually see in many instances their kids are still products of the generation, which is, let's just say awkward. And that's being nice.
Should men settle for something less than "ideal"?
This should always be considered, but it's a value judgment. It depends on what Lawrence says below, as well, and how well you can rationalize or justify having children as the swap, because that's all you'll be proud about (if we're honest).
One should also evaluate one's value as a man in realistic terms
I've said always this is the biggest problem with the internet and the large number of average to below average men, in a world where chubby to fat women want 2 points higher or more.
If your ideal is unrealistic for you then you should change your ideal, or make it more realistic by improving your potential to attract someone.
Precisely. But this also has some objective component, as your location matters greatly towards what is "realistic". For example, it is quite obvious to me and has been for literally years to me at this point, no one in the culture will ask themselves, I wonder what Blade Runner might expect from a gf or wife, given his attributes? I'm serious, they don't even think about that question for a second, forget a minute. You can literally be a 1% in many categories and people will ask you, "Hey, what do you think of this 35 year old?" :ROFLMAO:
A lot of American guys would kill to have a nice, attractive, feminine girl pursuing them. The hot virgin blonde idea has a lot of glamour attached to it, but once the allure wears off would that ideal girl really be that great as you have it in your head? Because every time I've idealized something and pursued it to finally attain it, I always ask in the end "what was the big deal?"
This is true, but so many don't even have a history of even realizing it to any degree. It's not a big deal but if you don't get at least close to a girl's younger years, you literally don't get anything out of her. I'm just sayin'
 
A lot of American guys would kill to have a nice, attractive, feminine girl pursuing them. The hot virgin blonde idea has a lot of glamour attached to it, but once the allure wears off would that ideal girl really be that great as you have it in your head? Because every time I've idealized something and pursued it to finally attain it, I always ask in the end "what was the big deal?"

This girl's spending time with family, not dating 20 dudes on tinder. It's something you can work with and lead her. And those women who are always dressed to the nines are ultra high maintenance and you'll be waiting hours everytime you want to go out. There are advantages to the more casual style.
Yeah you make some good points. I initially thought she was dating 20 dudes on tinder, but that is not the case. I don't want to make too many assumptions because I don't know the whole story yet, but it's actually sounding like her family are the ones holding her back. That's not necessarily a deal breaker, but could also be headaches down the line. I just have to start taking her out and getting to know her more. I've been too judgemental and made some unfair assumptions.

My main thing is I've met some other women that are much safer choices on paper, but I don't enjoy talking to them as much. I think about this other girl a lot. At least I'm finally starting to see that this girl is sincere because of the effort that she's making. It's time to go for it.

Thank you for the advice.
 
I really dont know how to phrase this and it's really hard to say this in text with no context but I have a question that's been bothering me. I know it may come off as judgemental but it's not meant to be.

Should men settle for something less than "ideal"?
If I was 40+ I probably wouldn't even be trying with girls 18-26 range here in the states. That's still my fallback. If I can't get it going here I'll jet for Thailand and just join the Russians. The services I attend here in my own English speaking country of the US are in Greek anyway, so it's not really that big of a deal.

When you ask this question my thoughts are to consider how good of a position the guy is in before settling. Is he broke? Is 40s? 50s? Does he have health issues? Is he overweight? Does he have baggage? Mental problems?

I think before settling for something less than ideal we should do our best to get in a good position to increase our SMV. Become the traditional husband. Become a member of a Parish. Get our health in order. Get finances secure, even if it's something very basic just enough to cover basic expenses.

I liked the advice I heard about writing down everything we want from our ideal woman. Then scratch out ideal woman from the top of the list and write ideal ME.

If after we've done all we can, at some point it might be better to settle for something less than ideal and have realistic expectations, but I really think we have to get control of our thoughts and fight despondency and hopelessness. I mean in general, I'm not talking at you. I struggle with this myself, but for me it's mostly beating myself up for sleeping around so much, being a loner, being hateful and angry, etc.

I know this stuff is kind of obvious. I guess we'd need to know more about what your current game is here. Do you have a female prospect in mind? What's your stats matched up to her stats?

There are some things I'd just never consider settling for. If she has a kid. If she's fat. If she's too old to make babies. If she was a hooker. If she's super career oriented. Etc etc.

If it's slightly less good looking than average. If it's the wrong denomination (Or even religion like Buddhist) that requires some converting. If she's a little slow. Some things can be worked out and dealt with.

One of the worst relationships I've ever seen was a guy I used to teach English with in Thailand. He was in his 40s. The girl he was with was late 50s fat ogre with kids, and I believe an ex hooker on top of that (He met her in a hooker bar). He gave all of his salary to her every month, which was his only income. I'm not even sure he was sleeping with her.

He had it in his mind that his relationship was "different". Somehow it was special. Guys can rationalize themselves in some real doozies. He seemed to think it was what he deserved I guess. His had a big heart and it got the best of him, and he was CERTAINLY looking in the wrong place. A hooker bar. Smh.

There was no reason he couldn't have married an average looking 4 or 5 in her 20s if he had adjusted his lifestyle. He had issues with health as he was severely underweight, heavy smoker, and an insomniac, but he was still settling for something way off the mark. He could have done a lot better. He was a good guy.

Another guy I taught English with had divorced his crazy wife after 25 years of marriage in Europe and had a few kids with her. He was late 50s. Started over in Thailand. Wasn't in the best shape as he was overweight. Heavy drinker. Heart problems. Only money he had was his teaching income.

He married a 28 year old Christian Filipina teacher from another school that was probably a 6.5. She was lovely. A great mother. Very feminine and submissive. He had a kid with her. He's living happily ever after. And they weren't struggling to make ends meet or bitching about their kid being so expensive or whatever. They just had a normal life.

I guess my point is that it's easy to cut ourselves short or become hopeless, especially when looking in a western environment. There's definitely hope. Both of these men were raking in 35k baht a month (about 1000 usd). Both had baggage. They weren't young with 6 figures, 6 foot, and whatever else seems impossible to compete against or just bygone days.

There's alot of horror stories but I've seen some guys set themselves up nicely. Guys that on paper you wouldn't think had a shot at all. Here is an example of two guys with different thoughts about their situation and approaches that led to drastically different outcomes. I've got plenty of stories like this. Of course we don't hear about the good ones often, but moreso, especially on the internet, about the nightmares.

The guy with the Filipina that succeeded had a great personality. Good Christian morals. He was a great father. He was confident. He was charming. He was intelligent. She didn't care about his money or past. This can certainly happen to anyone else. She loved him because he committed to her through marriage, made a home with her (a rental house that cost them about 10k baht a month, or 300 US, in a safe and decent Thai neighborhood), was a good leader, and gave her his heart.

And this makes it much harder for me at 35, when I have my crap together physically and financially and so on, to consider any sort of "game" for a woman in her late 20s in USA, when I know what I could get elsewhere, because I've seen these types of relationships work out firsthand, and even blew my own chances several times through lack of commitment, improper values, forgoing truly embedding myself in the community, and just continual loafing as a 'Marlboro man'.

Settling for less than ideal for me is the 26 year old I mentioned above. Which probably seems ridiculous to many outside of this forum, and their feedback isn't helpful and just contributes to further despondency and hopeless thoughts.

I don't think I'm crazy to expect a 19 year old Filipina virgin. Despite my imperfect past, I really don't think this is out of the question. Even at early 40s, if I stay on top of things, this could still be the same expectation.

Other settling for less than ideal scenarios I have are moving said hypothetical 19 year old Filipina here in the US, or having a type of semi long distance dual living situation.

But sucking it up and being some kind of hero to save a fatty with kids as her eggs are drying up is just out of the question. I'd rather be single doing monk mode celibacy for the rest of my life.
 
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Love is a dance. The man leads, and the woman follows. A woman who follows "submits" to you. That's what submission means. A good loyal woman is a good follower.

So in the game of love, ask her to dance; ask her to follow you wherever you may be going, and see if she follows. Don't worry if she rejects you. Doesn't matter. Ask a different girl. Keep asking until you find one who is loyal and gives you good, reliable boners. That's really all it comes down to: loyalty and the boner test. Everything else can be improved or worked on. A loyal woman will do almost anything for you: change her diet, her religion, her hobbies, her hairstyle, her clothes, etc. A disloyal woman isn't good for anything. A loyal woman will stay married to you for life. A disloyal woman will rape you in court.

But when it comes to sexual attraction, it's binary. She either turns you on or doesn't. It's impossible to have children with a woman who doesn't give you boners, so those women are off the table.

Game and love are very simple, but men overthink things and make it complicated. A fear of rejection comes from a lack of fear of death IMO. You will die, you will be judged, anything a woman says to you is trivial by comparison .

Also, the reason "oneitis" is a sin is because "Thou shall not covet." Do not covet any one woman. Until a woman marries you, she's not yours. So don't ever get your hopes up on anyone because you are coveting that which is not yours. Don't break any of the 10 commandments, it goes without saying. The big 10 aren't even the entirety of the law, but, they are the bare minimum and we can strive not to break them. Don't covet any woman.
 
Great post, I agree with all but this line here.

If men start to see sex not as a pleasure they need to "enjoy life", but instead a huge responsibility, then the half-drunk skank is one to avoid at all costs.

Do you want to create a child with her? Probably not.
Do you want to form a bond with her? Probably not.
Will it then be, at the best, very awkward the next day? Yes
Will that awkwardness end there, or will she tell her friends you are a creep that "took advantage" of her? Possibly yes.

I think if men start to view sex as a huge responsibility, of tying your entire life to another person, then men would start to make a lot better decisions and society as a whole would move in the right direction.
There's a WN podcast called Full Haus.

A few episodes back, Thomas Sewell was on. He talked about being at a club with some friends and a girl came up and grinded on him and he did not respond the way she wanted him to and it kind of broke her as a person.

A must-listen in the context of this thread. Start at precisely 2:07:30 in. Sewell is the Australian guy.

 
Love is a dance. The man leads, and the woman follows. A woman who follows "submits" to you. That's what submission means. A good loyal woman is a good follower. So in the game of love, ask her to dance; ask her to follow you wherever you may be going, and see if she follows. Don't worry if she rejects you. Doesn't matter. Ask a different girl. Keep asking until you find one who is loyal and gives you good, reliable boners. That's really all it comes down to: loyalty and the boner test. Everything else can be improved or worked on. A loyal woman will do almost anything for you: change her diet, her religion, her hobbies, her hairstyle, her clothes, etc. A disloyal woman isn't good for anything. A loyal woman will stay married to you for life. A disloyal woman will rape you in court. But when it comes to sexual attraction, it's binary. She either turns you on or doesn't. It's impossible to have children with a woman who doesn't give you boners, so those women are off the table. Game and love are very simple, but men overthink things and make it complicated. A fear of rejection comes from a lack of fear of death IMO. You will die, you will be judged, anything a woman says to you is trivial by comparison . Also, the reason "oneitis" is a sin is because "Thou shall not covet." Do not covet any one woman. Until a woman marries you, she's not yours. So don't ever get your hopes up on anyone because you are coveting that which is not yours. Don't break any of the 10 commandments, it goes without saying. The big 10 aren't even the entirety of the law, but, they are the bare minimum and we can strive not to break them. Don't covet any woman.

This post really helped me out. I asked a girl out yesterday that I've run into a few times. Unfortunately she's moving to a new state in a week. Sucks because she's nice and our conversations always go well.

I ran into another girl tonight that I've talked to a few times and got her number. I'll probably take her out for ice cream.

I still think about that other girl from my initial post a lot. I will have to take her out soon.

It really does just take some balls, abundance and not caring if they say yes or no. Thank you again to everyone for the advice.
 
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