Cosmology Debate Thread ("Space Is Fake")

[Northumber]

Weren't people from the pre-modern era also extremely interested in the "heavenly bodies" and tracking their movements? And yeah this also includes believers from the most pious age when there was a united, catholic (small c) church that was providing European civilization with a Christian lens to view the world.

Yes, they would perceive meaning from patterns. The modern era attempted to jettison those kinds of concepts.

But practically speaking they could gain power from doing so. If the shaman or priests had the technical power to predict something like an eclipse it would be very convincing they have access to the gods.

And practically speaking we still aren't that removed from this seeing that people tend to worship "the science" and "scientists" again for their apparent technical prowess and predictive abilities.

 

[MosesTheBlack]

I am not a flat earther but the constant urge to limit others in their speech is annoying.

If you feel so confident about your worldview and arguments why not discuss it?

Why should we allow bumbling idiots to spout their ideas? Especially on concepts that are well proven?

This is the equivalent of giving the village idiot a megaphone.

If someone really believes that the earth is flat, space is not real, or satellites don’t exist, they should be regulated to a mental asylum and evaluated or thrown in a facility with other below 50 IQ people.

 

[Caduceus]

Why should we allow bumbling idiots spout their ideas? Especially on concepts that are well proven?

This is the equivalent of giving the village idiot a megaphone and leading people astray like the pied piper.

If someone really believes that the earth is flat, space is not real, or satellites don’t exist, they should be regulated to a mental asylum and evaluated or thrown in a facility with other below 50 IQ people.

You need to tone down the insults.
The same exact arguments you're ranting on about, are used to attack people of the Christian faith.

 

[LaAguilaNegra]

Why should we allow bumbling idiots spout their ideas? Especially on concepts that are well proven?

This is the equivalent of giving the village idiot a megaphone and leading people astray like the pied piper.

If someone really believes that the earth is flat, space is not real, or satellites don’t exist, they should be regulated to a mental asylum and evaluated or thrown in a facility with other below 50 IQ people.

You sound like one of those Covid zealots that wanted to throw others and I in camps (or worse) for 'not trusting the science'.

Your posts also has about 10 insults and zero arguments.

 

[MosesTheBlack]

You sound like one of those Covid zealots that wanted to throw others and I in camps (or worse) for 'not trusting the science'.

Your posts also has about 10 insults and zero arguments.

Equating concepts like space, the earth, and modern technology, to Covid nonsense is a massssive stretch there champ.

 

[LaAguilaNegra]

Equating concepts like space, the earth, and modern technology, to Covid nonsense is a massssive stretch their champ.

I am not equating any of those, just your attitude.

 

[MosesTheBlack]

I am not equating any of those, just your attitude.

Which is what? I’m calling out foolish ideas and probably trolls who don’t believe in space? Are you kidding? Even ancient people pre-Christianity understood what we are talking about here (minus satellites) and space and the heavens are documented in the Bible.

 

[GodfatherPartTwo]

Amos 5:8 He who made the Pleiades and Orion And overturns the shadow of death into morning, Who also darkens day into night, Who calls for the waters of the sea And pours them out on the surface of the earth, Yahweh is His name.

This thread is unbiblical.

 

[Caduceus]

Which is what? I’m calling out foolish ideas and probably trolls who don’t believe in space? Are you kidding? Even ancient people pre-Christianity understood what we are talking about here (minus satellites) and space and the heavens are documented in the Bible.

The bible also says there is a firmament above the earth (with water outside it) in literally the first few lines of Genesis.

 

[GodfatherPartTwo]

 

[MosesTheBlack]

The bible also says there is a firmament above the earth (with water outside it) in literally the first few lines of Genesis.

And? Is this like your attempt at a ‘strong’ and convincing argument? I’ll have to laugh. This is outdated cosmology from the writers of Genesis. There are a lot of things stated in the Bible, which is why it should be studied under a priest or other qualified person. Is there an Orthodox priest alive that claims that space isn’t real?

 

[LaAguilaNegra]

Amos 5:8 He who made the Pleiades and Orion And overturns the shadow of death into morning, Who also darkens day into night, Who calls for the waters of the sea And pours them out on the surface of the earth, Yahweh is His name.

This thread is unbiblical.

I think a biblical and historical discussion on cosmology would be better than the current emotion laden back and forth.

The 'Flat Earth' cosmological worldview is as historical as the spherical earth cosmology. I have to admit that I am not well versed on the topic, but didn't the ancient Israelites believe the Earth was flat? As in Heaven on top, Earth in the middle and Hell below?

 

[GuitarVH]

Space is clearly a biblical concept. The heavens that are referred to in Genesis is meant as the literal heavens, not the same as paradise. I don't see the problem with exploring the parts we can reach, just like exploring the oceans etc.

I was just answering your question as to what the motivation would be to challenge the ancient and Biblical cosmology, especially within the last 100 years with the Big Bang theory, ever-expanding space and trillions of different galaxies and solar systems. It is completely different than what people believed for thousands of years.

 

[GodfatherPartTwo]

The 'Flat Earth' cosmological worldview is as historical as the spherical earth cosmology

Just because something is historical, doesn't make it true.

I have to admit that I am not well versed on the topic, but didn't the ancient Israelites believe the Earth was flat? As in Heaven on top, Earth in the middle and Hell below?

That is the real question and there's arguments that go both ways. There is no question that we can view the cosmos as three-tiered in a spiritual fashion. Proponents of flat earth will take such passages and interpret them according to their pancake earth view, in a woodenly literalistic manner.

Flat Earth is a secular psy-op designed to discredit the Bible by association. I am concerned for those who have taken the bait and bought into the false-dialectic, as if believing in Flat Earth makes you more of a Christian, despite all empirical evidence to the contrary.

 

[abraham]

Out of curiosity, to those pro space is fake and gay, where does the sun reside then? I'm guessing the sky but seems that'd make earth a wee bit toasty. Genuine question as I'm not well versed on fake space theory.

 

[Caduceus]

And? Is this like your attempt at a ‘strong’ and convincing argument? I’ll have to laugh. This is outdated cosmology from the writers of Genesis. There are a lot of things stated in the Bible, which is why it should be studied under a priest or other qualified person. Is there an Orthodox priest alive that claims that space isn’t real?

You do realise you are on a Christian forum right ?
Claiming something from the bible is "outdated" is a quick way to get banned on your first day here.

 

[Caduceus]

Out of curiosity, to those pro space is fake and gay, where does the sun reside then? I'm guessing the sky but seems that'd make earth a wee bit toasty. Genuine question as I'm not well versed on fake space theory.

There are various theories, but one is that the sun and moon are a lot closer to earth than we are told, but they are also not "physical" bodies that you can touch or "land" on.

 

[MosesTheBlack]

You do realise you are on a Christian forum right ?
Claiming something from the bible is "outdated" is a quick way to get banned on your first day here.

I’m scared. Might be for the better if the people on here believe ridiculous things like space doesn’t exist.

So nothing in the Bible is outdated and everything is literally true? Do we want to start playing the take random quotes from the Bible and make all Christian’s look like idiots game that atheists play?

Hold on, you don’t believe in space, you’re proving their points that we have complete imbeciles ‘on our side.’ No wonder why we keep on losing.

 

[GodfatherPartTwo]

While I detest the Flat Earth psy-op, I detest the idea that Genesis is falsifiable and outdated even more.

 

[Wutang]

Is there any distinction between "space is fake" and "flat earth"? Or do people hold that space is fake but we are on a globe?

I just noticed that the OP of this thread was also advocating for flat earth in one of his previous posts so it seems both topics are linked together in the minds of many people.