Genealogist
Catholic
Catholicism: Criticism & Debate Thread
- Thread starter PurpleUrkel
- Start date
Im in classes again…
Pew research is funded by Protestants(Jews). Templeton.
We would have to see official data
Found this site from googling.
You hear about some Jewish/Protestant lunacy in US. Give it 2-4 years it arrives Europe. Now it’s reparations for blacks. FFS. This is Jewish. They’ve been stealing Germans for the last few decades with that bullshit. Wanna bet blacks will fuennel the money to Jews?
Pew research is funded by Protestants(Jews). Templeton.
We would have to see official data
Found this site from googling.
You hear about some Jewish/Protestant lunacy in US. Give it 2-4 years it arrives Europe. Now it’s reparations for blacks. FFS. This is Jewish. They’ve been stealing Germans for the last few decades with that bullshit. Wanna bet blacks will fuennel the money to Jews?
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Is this meant to answer my question? There's some good there, but the devil is in the details.
Let's walk through it logically. The Catholic Church validated your marriage. Years later, you get an annulment, the Catholic Church pronounces that no valid marriage ever occurred. Were you ever in the state of being married or were you not? If you were not, then the Catholic Church was wrong to validate your marriage in the first place. If you were, then the Catholic Church is wrong to pronounce you as never married.
The annulment is an inherently contradictory and inconsistent doctrine.
Annulment is when something prior to marriage was wrong. Which wasn’t known for some reason. There was never a marriage. Just an aparent. After a valid marriage nothing can be done. You can’t break a valid marriage. Period. The church doesn’t invalidate marriages. It just declares its invalidity. In Latin countries nobody annules. You divorce in civil and don’t marry by the church again. The annulment had to be ruled by the pope. I think.you needed an audience with pope.
I can brush some books on this. One teacher went temporary crazy. The law philosophy teacher. He also gave Roman classes law. And was studying some theory.
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Does the Catholic Church validate marriages even when it doesn't know if the conditions for marriage are valid or not? Because it's wrong for doing so.
Effectively, the annulment is an admission of the church that the church made a mistake in recognizing the marriage in the first place.
Finding reasons for why the marriage is invalid after the parties want to divorce, rather than knowing them before the parties are married, is awfully convenient and is a perfect showcase of the pharasaical, letter of the law slipperiness that the annulment is criticized for.
Shaquilleoatmeal
Protestant
Just a quick criticism on “Ash Wednesday”:
Matthew 6:16
Moreover when ye fast, be not, as the hypocrites, of a sad countenance: for they disfigure their faces, that they may appear unto men to fast. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
Matthew 6:16
Moreover when ye fast, be not, as the hypocrites, of a sad countenance: for they disfigure their faces, that they may appear unto men to fast. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
Genealogist
Catholic
An annulment is a judgement that the marriage was essentially flawed from the beginning, therefore null. You can claim that specific annulments are badly judged, but in principle it's not divorce, and your tu quoque fails. Awful argument.
Looll. Leading question your honor. Sustained?
It´s pretty simple actually.
Let me give you an example. Which is not good to do but still.
A. Imagine you buy a house. After you buy the house you regret buying it. You regret the color. The area, etc. After you bought the house you regret it.
B. Imagine you buy a house. After you buy the house it´s discovered you were blackmailed to do it. Or you faked your ID to buy it. And you are underage.
So in both cases you bought a house. In one case you freely decided after the act you want to cancel it. The other it´s prior to the deed.
But I can give you another example in this whorestantism time might make sense:
C. Imagine someone marries a trans. And he knows it´s a trans. But his a fag and want to marry a man anyway. After a while. Gets tired of him and decide to divorce.
D. Imagine you marry a trans. He fakes all records. And you think it´s a woman. The Church is also mistaken by the false records. After it´s discovered he was a man.
The Church obviously cannot know everything. Only god is omniscient. How can a priest know if you´re being blackmailed, etc? In civil law this is normally called vices of consent.
If you still don´t undestand it will explain further.
Of course the Church can make a mistake. As a notary can make a mistake. What are you asking? If a priest can know everything. Your question is nonsense. Of course they can make a mistake. But the mistake is done honestly without intention. You expect what? For the church to hire private detectives?
You are too emotionally invested.
AHAHAHAHAHAH you´re a protestant. I thought you were a Ortho. What a waste of time. Will leave it regardless for others. A protestant making questions about catholic divorce. One day I will see a lamp piss on a dog. I can guarrrantee you this. Prots are good for business. They have a good work ethic. Religion or woman. Not so much. It´s.a tradeoff.
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I agree that the Catholic Church makes mistakes, but in this case, the mistake is in creating this annulment procedure and believing it is anything else but a divorce.
If the Catholic Church can retroactively find itself to be wrong about your married status, then marriage in the Catholic Church is fairly meaningless.
The Church decides nothing. It´s God who decided. Church just tries imperfectly to express God.
If all conditions were met. You can´t divorce.
When Henry VIII divorced. Times were actually a little bit different. Nobody at that time expected woman one day could use divorce to rape you financially. You cannot fully trust a woman. As much as you love her. Because you have this sword over your head. And protestants started this shit. Divorce is an attack on family. On man. Who is the head.
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Perseus66
Protestant
Protestants = Jews?
paternos, I thought you wanted to take a break from CiK.
paternos, I thought you wanted to take a break from CiK.
Shaquilleoatmeal
Protestant
@lacobus paternos with his nonsense again.
I appreciate you sending your sources, I really do. But it would facilitate the debate better if you made application from your sources and used that to argue back with me instead.
One thing that has become increasingly clear as regards the Catholic faith, most of these Catholics (including yourself) are in love with the idea of the Roman Catholic Church as the "one true church." But they are not necessarily in love with the current Pope.
This doesn't necessarily mean Eastern Orthodoxy is the "default" position. But it does highlight the difficulty of holding the traditional Catholic faith when the current Pope is anything but a traditionalist.
If you want to go on the offense, as if that is a counter for the failure of Roman Catholic theology, then I'll play ball. But I only do so out of love for both Catholics and Orthodox, whom I feel are "trading in the Word of God for the tradition of men." And since this is a Catholic debate thread, I've sat out of it until now because 'Protestant vs Catholic" is beyond passè.
I can only cite the anachronism, the inconsistency of the Catholic magisterium with Scripture, etc, so many times. The Lord will be the One to vindicate one or the other when He returns.
You raise good points and I will ask my Bishop more about this. I'm pretty sure he'll disagree with your position, but, he is also 100% anti-Ecumenical.
He taught me how to dismiss ecumenism in one sentence - "What does Ecumenical even mean? It's Greek for, 'Of the Emperor.' Where is the Emperor today?" Which is the point - how can there even be a Ecumenical Patriarch without an Emperor? It's just fantasy and Ecumenism doesn't exist.
As for someone who is Orthodox yet still wants to save his family - why can't he attend Orthodox Liturgy's twice or three times a month, and go to Latin Mass once or twice a month, and simply refrain from praying with them? If this man is intent on saving or improving his home Church, to the best of his ability, what would be wrong with such an action?
Genealogist
Catholic
Most Catholics are ignorant about the nature and purpose of the papal office.
Most traditionalists have embraced a heretical notion of the papacy to justify recognizing Bergoglio as the pope.
A strong minority remains integrally Catholic, rejecting Vatican II and its fake popes.
It would help to see what the divorce statistics are based on various religious group.
Edit. Be aware that Catholic has a much larger group than Orthodox Christian groups (i.e., Russian Orthodox, Greek Orthodox, etc.).
Bro this poll is a joke for Orthodox, they polled 182 Orthodox to get their numbers for an entire religion and nation??? How can they even release this in good faith, total fake news.
1. Joke or not, what is the largest religious group and population in the United States?
2. Protestant and Catholic groups have always been the largest religious groups in the United States.
3. Orthodox Christianity is and has always been small in the United States. Majority of Orthodox Christian populations are in Eastern Europe with Russia being the largest.
4. Protestant and Catholic population grew around the 19th Century due to immigration from Europe.
5. The area I currently live in is predominately Catholic. We have a very tiny Orthodox Christian population.
6. As for "total fake news", do you want to know what is really fake? Living in a "(((Judeo)))-Christian" country. Look around: we got faggots dressing up in women's clothes and shoes; trannies taking over women's sports; pedos using Drag Queen Story Hour as a cover to diddle kids; gay female pastors-activists leading a congregation of unhinged nut jobs; and so on.
Divorce got worse when the fake "(((Judeo)))-Christian" values took over.
"(((Judeo)))-Christian", my ass.
Not true. The biggest group was and still is protestants. Not catholics. US emigration came from protestant countries. England and Germany.
USA is a protestant nation. Now infecting all the others in the west. Obviously protestant european countries are the first to fall.
But this protestantism. Was based in the roman catholic church. Nowadays it´s completed diluted by jews.
Not true. Protestant has been the religion of US since day one. And from protestantism. The most liberal kind. Mainline. But it wasn´t heavily diluted.
Unless you want to count the indians religion.
You had jewish emigration due to nazi Germany. Which accelerated the dilution.
Catholicism might be increasing due to SA emigration. But it´s not the main religion. If it was the faggotry would tone down. Even though it´s catholics from the lowest brackets.
Hollywood was controlled by Jesuits. And it kept them from being the whore factory they are today. Sex and the city is one of the most filthy tv shows ever produced to the masses. But protestants are now jews. Everything is wrong in that show. In every 3 movies produced. 2 are liberal jewish/gay protestantism vomit.
US cartoons are shit. The father is always some imbecile. Russian cartoons are better. I have to watch the trailers. Before allowing my kids to watch. Sheldon tv shows seems normal.
Orthodoxy is irrelevant in western countries.
Fake judeo-christian values took over what? Themselves? Your implying US was what? A ortho country? Muslim? You speak english. From England. A protestant country. Anglican at least. But still protestant. US was always and still is a protestant(jewish) country. Which nowadays translates to a jewish country. Comparing Israel and US policies regarding family would be interesting.
Jewish religion and protestantism are a disease. They are the same. And it will only get worse. US is at this moment the country with the worse policies regarding family. The only thing US still excel is in business. Which no catholic can say protestantism is not superior. It´s a trade off.
Protestant economies are much better than catholic or orthodoxy. You just have to pay the piper. And have trans, whores and fags. Liberal economies infiltrate into the remaining values. Having protestant economies. And catholic social/ family values would be great. US had it for a while. Unintended consequences are a bitch though. When you rebelled against the pope. You rebelled against man authority.
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Pretty certain the church has been or is infiltrated by the intelligence agencies at this point. Their wealth is unimaginable, and lots of it hidden or priceless (artifacts, paintings, churches, etc.)
The accusation of gay priests is overblown. Personally I’ve never met one, or been part of any diocese where there was even an accusation of abuse. Although the pedophilia scandal and coverup was real and disgusting. Some priests I’ve known were rumored to have mistresses, some even quit to marry them. Allowing priests to marry would help this, and being vigilant on not allowing gays into seminaries.