Bitcoin and Crypto Thread

When you're talking about something as fundamental to society as money, you really need something that's highly functional at the lowest common denominator. And Bitcoin ain't it.
Bitcoin maxis would argue that Bitcoin ease of use, user experience, functionality is slowly increasing with time as happened with the internet and email, etc.

Originally to buy stocks you had to have a full service broker, make a phone call to place an order and pay a big commission, safe keep your physical stock certificates, etc. Now people just have a Robin Hood app on their phone and trade for "free" (by in effect selling their order flow data to hedge funds) instantaneously. And today even grandmas can use email and credit cards.

People today can buy Bitcoin from a Bitcoin ATM, they can open an account on Binance or Coinbase etc and buy it there, there are companies like Bitpay which intermediate Bitcoin payments, etc. This was all stuff that wasn't widely available 10 years ago, but yes there is still a lot of work to do, I just think you need to have more patience for the user infrastructure around Bitcoin to be fully built out. Perhaps another 10 years and Bitcoin will be convenient, easy to use and ubiquitous for the average normie.

The internet was arguably invented in 1983 and only became public in 1993. But it really only arguably became fully built out in the 2010s where internet became fast, everybody in poor countries had access, people had internet on their smartphones, it was convenient to buy stuff online, social media, etc.,
 
You know what is funny is Peter Schiff doesn't even have to buy Bitcoin. If he just stacked all the Bitcoin he received as payment for selling gold (rather than getting Bitpay to convert it to fiat) over time it would add up to a sizeable sum.

I wonder how many years it will take for Peter Schiff to change his mind about hating Bitcoin.
He 100% understands Bitcoin and is stacking as hard as he can, using the millions his business generates in gold transaction fees.
I would guess he has thousands if not 10000 btc.

I've listened to Schiff enough to know he knows what's broken and that Bitcoin is the only solution.
 
He 100% understands Bitcoin and is stacking as hard as he can, using the millions his business generates in gold transaction fees.
I would guess he has thousands if not 10000 btc.
So you think Peter Schiff is being extremely dishonest with all his talk of Bitcoin being a Ponzi and a scam etc?

I mean its obviously him talking his own book because he has a business selling gold and silver and bitcoin competes for his customers money.
 
But they also have the same weaknesses... that is, they are things of the material world that cannot protect you in the same way that a chainsaw, wood splitter, and a gallon of gasoline can in providing you with heat during an unusually harsh winter. Spend your time in the obsessive JQ mindset of usury and money and "interest" and "profits" and "loss" at your own peril. You only have so much "ram" and storage space in your mind, fill it with real world skill sets that you can personally control and master and repeat over and over again regardless of society's external circumstances.

The sooner you start preparing for a world in which ALL money is useless, the sooner you will be free from this obsessive talk about the dark world of crypto.

GET. OUT. NOW.

Stop being a crypto jew.

You're welcome.
Bitcoin is not crypto.

Money is not evil. Fake government money is evil.

Bitcoin eliminates usury. It is truth, just as 1+1=2 is a truth of the universe. Bitcoin follows the rules of nature. God's rules.

Bitcoin is not about taking from others. That zero sum thinking is because we all grew up with evil, broken money. Bitcoin is freedom. To see that, you must free your mind from the prison that was created for it by evil forces.
 
So you think Peter Schiff is being extremely dishonest with all his talk of Bitcoin being a Ponzi and a scam etc?

I mean its obviously him talking his own book because he has a business selling gold and silver and bitcoin competes for his customers money.
I'm 90% certain that is the case, yes. He understands money on a fundamental level, which, once you do, it's almost impossible to not see the solution, he's talked enough about Bitcoin to understand it.

He is far too intelligent to misuse terms like ponzi and apply to bitcoin
 
I'm 90% certain that is the case, yes. He understands money on a fundamental level, which, once you do, it's almost impossible to not see the solution, he's talked enough about Bitcoin to understand it.

He is far too intelligent to misuse terms like ponzi and apply to bitcoin

You are calling Peter Schiff a liar. Seriously? He's one of the most honest financial commentators out there.
 
You are calling Peter Schiff a liar. Seriously? He's one of the most honest financial commentators out there.
He is either stacking or just has severe cognitive dissonance since his livelihood depends on the crap he's selling....either way, honey badger don't care.
 
Hence why Bitcoin will never enjoy mainstream adoption. It's simply too cumbersome and unforgiving for a person of average temperament and intelligence to use reliably, especially with their entire net worth riding on the line. High IQ internet libertarians (who comprise the majority of vocal Bitcoin maxis) make the mistake of projecting their own thinking and abilities on the greater mass of people. But this is obviously ridiculous. The average person is no more capable of wisely and safely taking custody of their own Bitcoin than they are squatting 800 lbs. or writing a great novel. When you're talking about something as fundamental to society as money, you really need something that's highly functional at the lowest common denominator. And Bitcoin ain't it.
If you haven't noticed, the more capable and responsible always thrive and survive at levels the less aware or stragglers don't. BTCs key aspects won't be based on mid to late adopters, it already is what it is, they'll either adopt it or pay the consequences, like anyone else right now of "average" intelligence who saves in fiat, getting abused in that (same) fashion. The moral part of it is at least they had a shot, and like you, most won't listen, but that's fine because we tried to tell you.

Your mistake again is projecting on the world what has been and without an imagination of what will be. We're going into the greater depths of the crisis era which will change the world in ways most can't imagine - we've tried to tell you this has already happened many times before. I'm a little bit shocked that you aren't the least bit curious or open to something that is so historically obvious. But hey, that's why people get left behind.
 
He is either stacking or just has severe cognitive dissonance since his livelihood depends on the crap he's selling....either way, honey badger don't care.
I disagree with you here. If he is stacking, he's basically committing a social fraud that is absolutely hysterical in its proportion and doubling down, year after year. He's a crystallized thinker as you say. I don't see facial expressions or mannerisms that indicate at all that he's deceiving people. He's just incapable of admitting that something is better than gold, which he is emotionally locked into. That fits my theory of why people can't think critically, and he is a great example. It goes something like this, which we've seen a lot on this thread:

"That can't happen, money has always been as we know it."
"The God-State complex won't allow that to happen."
"Gold has been used for thousands of years" (but I won't mention how they jettisoned that in 1971 because of its problems for a modern world/global economy).

It all boils down to the previous generations having shaped their minds in a paradigm of trust, but now, even though they also see there is nothing actually to trust (and wasn't previously) they still can't give up the ghost that the solution is decentralization and admit you don't NEED to trust anyone or anything, because we've discovered how not to.
 
What is currently happening to ETH is the fate of every crypto project. No one with institutional money was fooled by the ETH ETF. Those hoping for a crypto bull market like 2021 should use caution.
 
I disagree with you here. If he is stacking, he's basically committing a social fraud that is absolutely hysterical in its proportion and doubling down, year after year. He's a crystallized thinker as you say. I don't see facial expressions or mannerisms that indicate at all that he's deceiving people. He's just incapable of admitting that something is better than gold, which he is emotionally locked into. That fits my theory of why people can't think critically, and he is a great example. It goes something like this, which we've seen a lot on this thread:

"That can't happen, money has always been as we know it."
"The God-State complex won't allow that to happen."
"Gold has been used for thousands of years" (but I won't mention how they jettisoned that in 1971 because of its problems for a modern world/global economy).

It all boils down to the previous generations having shaped their minds in a paradigm of trust, but now, even though they also see there is nothing actually to trust (and wasn't previously) they still can't give up the ghost that the solution is decentralization and admit you don't NEED to trust anyone or anything, because we've discovered how not to.

Very good argument!
 
What is currently happening to ETH is the fate of every crypto project.
Including Bitcoin, which will just be the last domino to fall. It's very odd that you clearly recognize all other crypto as being worthless and without much use, but have a glaring blind spot in the case of Bitcoin. I mean, you guys literally portray Bitcoin as a discovery akin to fire or electricity, when in reality it's no different from these other useless cryptos. Literally the only thing going for it is its network effect, aka popularity. Bitcoin will be as worthless as every other failed crypto project when its popularity begins to fade, which could happen quickly for a myriad of different reasons.
 
Including Bitcoin, which will just be the last domino to fall. It's very odd that you clearly recognize all other crypto as being worthless and without much use, but have a glaring blind spot in the case of Bitcoin.
Bitcoin has superior monetary properties. Crypto is just digital fiat, with scammers creating unlimited tokens and selling them to fools. The fact that they copied bitcoin's code, does not make them the same.
I mean, you guys literally portray Bitcoin as a discovery akin to fire or electricity, when in reality it's no different from these other useless cryptos. Literally the only thing going for it is its network effect, aka popularity.
The US Dollar has a large network effect, aka popularity. The Zimbabwe Dollar does not. Yes, that is the difference in value - the network of people who will accept it as money. They are fundamentally the same technology, the difference in value is the network.
Bitcoin will be as worthless as every other failed crypto project when its popularity begins to fade, which could happen quickly for a myriad of different reasons.
Desperate governments trying to survive by printing money exponentially faster, enacting unrealized capital gains taxes, un-banking dissenters, and censoring the internet? I think bitcoin, keet, and nostr, will be very popular.
 
@scorpion What's your thoughts on Monero? It solved all the issues with Bitcoin and the Monero community doesn't worship it like a god. It's actually the most actively used cryptocurrency in real life. I can understand you being you being anti-Bitcoin, but surely you can't be anti-Monero?
 
The US Dollar has a large network effect, aka popularity. The Zimbabwe Dollar does not. Yes, that is the difference in value - the network of people who will accept it as money. They are fundamentally the same technology, the difference in value is the network.
Right, but the dollar is popular for a good reason: because it is the global reserve currency issued by the most powerful government on the planet. Bitcoin is popular only because people have a delusional belief that it will continue to appreciate in value forever, simply because "there are only 21 million of them!" But the fact that only 21 million worthless internet tokens called Bitcoins exist does not make them inherently valuable, and at some point reality will assert itself and this will become painfully apparent.
Desperate governments trying to survive by printing money exponentially faster, enacting unrealized capital gains taxes, un-banking dissenters, and censoring the internet? I think bitcoin, keet, and nostr, will be very popular.
Again, you guys seem to have a severe difficulty in understanding the fact that just because the USD and other fiat currencies have weaknesses, that does not make Bitcoin inherently valuable. Bitcoin is not suddenly an amazing asset or a great currency just because the dollar is being inflated. It's still a worthless internet token whose only value is based on the false popular perception of unlimited future appreciation. You're participating in a self-inflicted, decentralized Ponzi scheme that your greed, hubris and delusion have hoodwinked you into believing is a revolutionary technology.
What's your thoughts on Monero? It solved all the issues with Bitcoin and the Monero community doesn't worship it like a god. It's actually the most actively used cryptocurrency in real life. I can understand you being you being anti-Bitcoin, but surely you can't be anti-Monero?
This is what's really funny to me. Because Monero is actually much closer to being the ideal asset/currency that chance vought and Blade Runner continually promote Bitcoin as being. With Monero you actually have privacy, and it's functional as a currency. People actually USE IT to buy things, and don't hoard it in anticipation of future appreciation. No one is sitting around writing kooky pseudo-religious books about how Monero is going to liberate mankind from the slavery of governments and eliminate wars. They just use it to buy stuff.

So no, I don't have a problem with Monero. I think it's kind of cool, actually. I would use it myself if I had reason to (currently, I don't). As I've said before, I also really don't have a problem with shitcoins and all the ridiculous speculation people do with them. Most people in that arena seem to understand they are gambling on moonshots and basically trying to rug pull and scam one another. Caveat emptor. People involved with shitcoins know what they're getting in to and generally deserve what they get (either a low probability big payday or, more likely, losing most of their money).

My problem is Bitcoin and all of the nonsense that goes along with it. It's literally become something akin to a religion for many people, as we see here in this very thread. It's basically a cult at this point, which can only survive by preaching and continually bringing in new members to buy and HODL to keep the price appreciation going. This is why Bitcoin maxis come across as both delusional and zealous. They've invested not only their money, but their faith and ego in Bitcoin. It's become everything to them, so they will basically defend it to the death. They're going to learn some very, very painful lessons sooner or later about the limits of their own understanding, the enormous trouble that hubris can get you into, and the difference between an asset with inherent value and a Ponzi asset.
 
Bitcoin’s monetary properties are what make it valuable to people.

What makes something valuable as money? The properties that are important for it to function as money.
1) scarcity
2) divisibility
3) transportability
4) assay ability
5) fungibility

I believe your main problem with Bitcoin is its scarcity (what you refer to as inherent value).
That is the most difficult mental hurdle to overcome when understanding what Bitcoin is, I will admit.
 
He 100% understands Bitcoin and is stacking as hard as he can, using the millions his business generates in gold transaction fees.
I would guess he has thousands if not 10000 btc.

I've listened to Schiff enough to know he knows what's broken and that Bitcoin is the only solution.
You "know" he is acquiring bitcoin, or you "think" he is?

Sometimes this forum gets carried away. Schiff has enough money in enough different asset classes that he doesn't need bitcoin as a life raft.

Whereas if you are an average guy struggling to buy a house, then bitcoin is likely to appeal to you more; it presents a scenario where a vision of the future will pan out better for you.
 
You "know" he is acquiring bitcoin, or you "think" he is?

Sometimes this forum gets carried away. Schiff has enough money in enough different asset classes that he doesn't need bitcoin as a life raft.

Whereas if you are an average guy struggling to buy a house, then bitcoin is likely to appeal to you more; it presents a scenario where a vision of the future will pan out better for you.
Very good point and I surely don’t know.
But, I think he understands it, knows the fiat system is doomed, and likely has a small percentage in it (1-10k). He can never admit it though because it’s his business, and also he gets a ton a free advertising as being the anti-bitcoiner with the most economic chops.
 
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