Vox Day

[scorpion]

Again, your opinion, I don't agree. And I would like to point out your hate-reading of Vox Popoli to trawl for stuff you can post here to mock him.

It is like you have a grudge, and I wonder if perhaps you have never got over a spat with him? Perhaps in the Vox Popoli comments, before they were removed? Did he ban you?

I find your lingering and bitter sniping to be quite gamma. Do you have any self-awareness?

I can assure you that I have no personal animosity whatsoever toward Vox, I merely find his grandiose bloviating and gargantuan ego to be amusing and worthy of occasional mockery. If you're one of his minions/pay pigs, you'll just have to deal with it. But you're perfectly free to disagree or call me a gamma male or whatever Vox's latest flavor of the month insult is - unlike the fearsome Dark Lord, I don't have paper thin skin and am not prone to banning people who publicly disagree with me.

 

[Ember]

I can assure you that I have no personal animosity whatsoever toward Vox, I merely find his grandiose bloviating and gargantuan ego to be amusing and worthy of occasional mockery.

Sure. You have been writing the same screed for many years. I'm convinced you have had a clash with him, and cannot get over it.

If you're one of his minions/pay pigs, you'll just have to deal with it. But you're perfectly free to disagree or call me a gamma male or whatever Vox's latest flavor of the month insult is - unlike the fearsome Dark Lord, I don't have paper thin skin and am not prone to banning people who publicly disagree with me.

If I see gamma behaviour in someone that is repeatedly accusing another person of being a gamma, then I will definitely call it out.

 

[scorpion]

Sure. You have been writing the same screed for many years. I'm convinced you have had a clash with him, and cannot get over it.

I doubt I've invested even 1/10th of 1% of the time and energy writing posts about Vox as he has obsessively posting about his ever-growing list of enemies over the years.

If I see gamma behaviour in someone that is repeatedly accusing another person of being a gamma, then I will definitely call it out.

You should go call out Vox on his blog then, since he is unquestionably the foremost example of this phenomenon. Oh wait, you can't, since he killed off his comments section in a fit of gamma rage and nuked his own traffic in the process.

 

[scary_robot_music]

I doubt I've invested even 1/10th of 1% of the time and energy writing posts about Vox as he has obsessively posting about his ever-growing list of enemies over the years.

You should go call out Vox on his blog then, since he is unquestionably the foremost example of this phenomenon. Oh wait, you can't, since he killed off his comments section in a fit of gamma rage and nuked his own traffic in the process.

Doesn't Vox still do comments on his social galactic site or something like that? At least there's a "Discuss on SG" link under all of his posts. I always thought the comments were the low point of his blog, so I never bothered, but I guess you could register there and "call him out." You'd get banned and at best if you're lucky maybe get a personalized post from Vox about your gamma behavior, but that's pretty much what would have happened back before he got kicked off of Wordpress. Come to think of it, I think comments on the blog itself went away when that happened, not because Vox shut them down.

 

[Ember]

I doubt I've invested even 1/10th of 1% of the time and energy writing posts about Vox as he has obsessively posting about his ever-growing list of enemies over the years.

But, you cannot let it go. Hate-reading Vox Popoli to find ammo to post here. And you have to misrepresent stuff, like the Me Too comment, so you can take another cheap shot.

You should go call out Vox on his blog then, since he is unquestionably the foremost example of this phenomenon.

In your opinion. I see it in you.

Oh wait, you can't, since he killed off his comments section in a fit of gamma rage and nuked his own traffic in the process.

Commenting is available on SG, as you already know, and have disingenuously ignored.

 

[scorpion]

But, you cannot let it go. Hate-reading Vox Popoli to find ammo to post here. And you have to misrepresent stuff, like the Me Too comment, so you can take another cheap shot.

I don't hate read, I find some of Vox's posts decent enough. But others are definitely worthy of mockery. You're apparently even more thin-skinned than Vox himself if you find my occasional deserved roasting of the man so objectionable.

In your opinion. I see it in you.

Why do you keep going back and forth with me? Are you trying to get me to ban you? Maybe you're used that sort of bullying treatment as one of Vox's minions? Unfortunately for you, I am not going to indulge your masochism.

Commenting is available on SG, as you already know, and have disingenuously ignored.

So I've heard. But I've never bothered to even visit SG, much less sign up for it, because I'm not one of Vox's sycophantic nut huggers.

 

[Ember]

I don't hate read, I find some of Vox's posts decent enough. But others are definitely worthy of mockery. You're apparently even more thin-skinned than Vox himself if you find my occasional deserved roasting of the man so objectionable.

Why do you keep going back and forth with me? Are you trying to get me to ban you? Maybe you're used that sort of bullying treatment as one of Vox's minions? Unfortunately for you, I am not going to indulge your masochism.

So I've heard. But I've never bothered to even visit SG, much less sign up for it, because I'm not one of Vox's sycophantic nut huggers.

A threat to ban? Fine, you win.

 

[scorpion]

A threat to ban? Fine, you win.

No, I explicitly said I'm NOT going to ban you just because you disagree with me or think I'm acting like a gamma (because I don't operate like Vox).

But really, this is growing quite tiresome. I don't actually hate Vox, I just like to poke fun at his ego from time to time.

 

[Ember]

No, I explicitly said I'm NOT going to ban you just because you disagree with me or think I'm acting like a gamma (because I don't operate like Vox).

You and I both know that the following is a thinly-veiled threat to stop replying, or get banned.
"Why do you keep going back and forth with me? Are you trying to get me to ban you?"

 

[scorpion]

You and I both know that the following is a thinly-veiled threat to stop replying, or get banned.
"Why do you keep going back and forth with me? Are you trying to get me to ban you?"

Dude, you clearly have some sort of Vox Day-inspired PTSD/Stockholm Syndrome going on. It's bizarre to be honest, but sadly very typical among his supporters. That's why you completely misinterpreted my post (which explicitly stated that I would not ban you for questioning or disagreeing with me, unlike Vox) as a threat. Just let it go.

 

[Ember]

I just don't agree with you Scorpion. That is all. You can try to paint me as a nut, but I barely ever think about Vox. I certainly don't subscribe to any of his enterprises.

 

[thinkreadwritecode]

I've long had this theory that the reason why Vox seems to maintain a robust readership despite obvious contempt for most of them is that there is a certain type of guy who's grown up in a pretty soft environment and subconsciously craves a harsh male authority to offer a challenge and conditional acceptance they've never really experienced otherwise.

Back when his blog had a normal comment section I often saw this kind of thing, lots of people asking for his opinion or trying to get his approval on this or that, almost always met with rude responses. I think this hints at a real, unmet need for a lot of guys; one that finds an unhealthy outlet in trying to solicit the approval of Harsh Internet Man. I think there's an interesting inverse to women who fall for bad boys because of unhealthy relationships with their own fathers. I've seen this same phenomenon with other prominent online dissidents but it's more conspicuous in Vox's case.

His blog can be decent as a sort of news aggregator, but whenever his personality/ego enter into the equation it gets pretty insufferable. As someone who started reading his blog daily in about 2008, I followed it until maybe 2018 or so. I actually felt Vox maybe hit his peak during the 2016 election, when he was frequently appearing in videos with Stefan Molyneux analyzing the election and current events. Those two somehow managed to bring out the best in each other, and it's been rather downhill for both since then.

That period also coincided with his best publishing streak with Castalia House where they were frequently putting out quality books by authors like John C Wright, before the comics and web projects took over and it was clear the chef was trying to spin too many plates at once. Checking Castalia's store it looks like they've barely published anything in years and a lot of books like John C Wright's appear to be gone.

I feel exactly the same way, but I bolded what I think is a great insight. The era of manosphere bloggers had loads of guys like that and so many of them were grifters in the way a lot of gaming communities ultimately gamed their male following so they could earn a living. I still see Owen Cook with ridiculous self-help Tony Robbin's type stuff, somehow the guy's never gotten sick of the hustle.

As for Vox, I remember feeling a weird desire to be seen approvingly by him. It's this need to have the badasses accept you, maybe because you feel a little bit of that power in turn. I do recall him responding quite rudely when I questioned some new project and comparing it to the Warmouse.

Ultimately I read him a lot, almost daily, for years and years because I wanted to read a smart Christian's take on contemporary things. His attacks against the atheists were the kind my younger self hungered for. Through Vox I eventually learned of Roissy, game, Roosh, libertarianism and so on. I do find myself less interested in him the older I get, I guess because the young man's drive to argue on the internet has left me. I am fasting from influencers and social media as much as I can.

It's a shame about Castalia House. They had some good titles and authors. I don't think I've purchased a title from them in years, only because nothing else has come out.

 

[thinkreadwritecode]

Wanted to hijack this again to mention something else I would think when I would read Vox Day. The thought that kept coming to mind is this: VD shows us time and time again that Sigma males are poor leaders. He talks about how Gammas are bad leaders, but Sigmas are equally bad, but I guess the sexier version. I would often think how Vox is a bad leader. All of those manosphere guys are bad leaders. As far as I know, they don't have successful companies, don't employ or provide anything except thoughts to their followers, and they are personally like a pyramid scheme where all the money gets sucked upwards. It's a complaint I had for a long time against Stefan Molyneux, how he is more than happy to take donations and sell a thing here or there, but he never made anything. At least Tom Woods (I think of him because of the libertarianism) tries to make businesses, had his history courses, the Ron Paul homeschool curriculum, HappyEarner, gave speeches in public, and so on. He was trying to help.

Vox never did any of that stuff. He had a few interviews many years ago, but that stopped quickly. His voxiversity was another failed attempt. He doesn't want to lead, never wanted to lead, always mentioned how he wasn't a leader, but an intellectual. He has his alternative platforms, which is a good idea, but by not playing the game it's like they don't even exist they're so small. It's like all of the rich conservatives who don't build anything to contend with in the culture wars. I do admire Vox's attempt, he did attempt, but his poor leadership skills, his inability to be a likeable person, seemed to shoot him in the foot. It was too important for him to be right about everything.

Anyway, that's my thinking, that Vox is an example of what happens with poor leadership. He had a huge following, a heavily trafficked blog, but couldn't capitalize on it, had no idea what to do with what he had. Influencers aren't leaders and shouldn't be treated as such. At best they might make good lieutenants, if they can get over their own egos.

 

[scorpion]

Anyway, that's my thinking, that Vox is an example of what happens with poor leadership. He had a huge following, a heavily trafficked blog, but couldn't capitalize on it, had no idea what to do with what he had. Influencers aren't leaders and shouldn't be treated as such. At best they might make good lieutenants, if they can get over their own egos.

Good posts and insight.

My basic read of Vox is that he's a very smart guy with a big ego who demonstrated a lot of potential and found some success in a variety of endeavors as a young man, but who never quite achieved greatness (and the accompanying recognition) in anything he did. And that really seems to gnaw at him, and fuels a permanent feeling of wounded pride and insecurity. This results in him regularly lashing out at both those whom he looks upon with envy - the people who achieved the success and recognition that escaped him - and those he views as his inferiors - his sycophantic followers on whom he regularly heaps scorn and abuse. If you think back to high school, you can probably remember a group of outcasts/misfits/nerds who grouped together because they didn't fit in anywhere else. There was usually one amongst them who stood out as a leader figure, a "King of the Dorks" so to speak, who himself was clearly a misfit, and jealous of the more popular and accepted crowd, but who also viewed himself as far superior to his dorky fellows. That's Vox.

I also agree that Vox is/was a much better influencer/blogger/philosopher type than leader. If the guy had simply focused on doing that stuff and managed to keep his ego in check and not take himself so seriously, he could have been 10x more influential than he is now and done a lot more good for our side.

 

[Pointy Elbows]

Vox is a great example of the RP/game/alt personality of 10 years ago. Smart (which pairs with gullibility/high trust as I've read - might explain his Q-blindness), low agreeableness (inhibits consensus/team building). I'm grateful that he keeps putting out pertinent observations and is an open advocate of Christendom and against Clown World. The sci-fi/comic fixation is not interesting to me. I imagine his is a lonely place, but he's the type that can handle it.

I wish him well and read his stuff often enough. Brother of a kind.

 

[Hermetic Seal]

All of those manosphere guys are bad leaders. As far as I know, they don't have successful companies, don't employ or provide anything except thoughts to their followers, and they are personally like a pyramid scheme where all the money gets sucked upwards.

I never thought about it that way before, but I think you're absolutely right. Vox would probably swear up and down he's not a leader, but why would you have "vile faceless minions" and be starting all these initiatives like Infogalactic and so on? His actions cause him to draw people toward him one way or another. You either own up to it and act like a responsible leader, or you just step back and don't do stuff where you're at the center. Either of these is quite doable, but that's not how he acts. I think the rise of Vox-as-leader-of-the-cause coincided with me losing interest in him. Back when he was just a guy with a blog who wrote some books, the personal aspects were easier to dismiss.

Vox never did any of that stuff. He had a few interviews many years ago, but that stopped quickly. His voxiversity was another failed attempt. He doesn't want to lead, never wanted to lead, always mentioned how he wasn't a leader, but an intellectual. He has his alternative platforms, which is a good idea, but by not playing the game it's like they don't even exist they're so small. It's like all of the rich conservatives who don't build anything to contend with in the culture wars. I do admire Vox's attempt, he did attempt, but his poor leadership skills, his inability to be a likeable person, seemed to shoot him in the foot. It was too important for him to be right about everything.

Vox made big promises about how Infogalactic was going to kill Wikipedia and had revolutionary technology incoming and so on, but of course none of that ever happened and it's basically just his own little world where he gets to be king. If you're not a guy craving the Mean Authority Figure to give you direction and purpose, there's little motivation to sign on to that.

Anyway, that's my thinking, that Vox is an example of what happens with poor leadership. He had a huge following, a heavily trafficked blog, but couldn't capitalize on it, had no idea what to do with what he had. Influencers aren't leaders and shouldn't be treated as such. At best they might make good lieutenants, if they can get over their own egos.

In retrospect it seems pretty straightforward, all Vox had to do was keep writing his blog, write and publish books, and maybe do the odd interview. He's actually a pretty good editor and worked well with John C. Wright and some others, it felt like publishing was where he kind of hit his groove, but he quickly jumped on comics stuff and it all felt like a grift from that point onward.

The thing is, he was good at publishing and editing, but it's too much of a background role for him, and on some subconscious level he wanted to lead, or be the face of something.

As far as his fixation on certain figures like Gaiman, Scalzi, Peterson, it's kind of a mixed bag because often his criticisms are on point, but there's clearly a subtext of jealousy or resentment driving him beyond concern for the greater good.

If you think back to high school, you can probably remember a group of outcasts/misfits/nerds who grouped together because they didn't fit in anywhere else. There was usually one amongst them who stood out as a leader figure, a "King of the Dorks" so to speak, who himself was clearly a misfit, and jealous of the more popular and accepted crowd, but who also viewed himself as far superior to his dorky fellows. That's Vox.

Nailed it.

 

[Cooper]

Vox is a great example of the RP/game/alt personality of 10 years ago. Smart (which pairs with gullibility/high trust as I've read - might explain his Q-blindness), low agreeableness (inhibits consensus/team building). I'm grateful that he keeps putting out pertinent observations and is an open advocate of Christendom and against Clown World. The sci-fi/comic fixation is not interesting to me. I imagine his is a lonely place, but he's the type that can handle it.

I wish him well and read his stuff often enough. Brother of a kind.

He seems to be doing well enough, living in Italy with his family, away from the pressure, maintaining separation between his US-based political discourse and his personal life.

 

[Hermetic Seal]

I completely missed this since I haven’t been following Vox closely at all for years now, but apparently the full version of his epic fantasy book A Sea Of Skulls finally came out recently. So I’ll give him some points for finally finishing it. I actually think his fantasy writing is pretty solid.

 

[clarencesd]

He seems to be doing well enough, living in Italy with his family, ...

If we can trust Wikipedia, then he actually lives in Switzerland.

 

[scorpion]

Best post from Vox I've seen in awhile. Wish he would do more of this content and less pearl clutching about Neil Gaiman's sex life.

The Minestrippers - Vox Popoli

It’s not just big established companies that are being managed into irrelevance and eventual extinction. A good article on the “mismanagerial class” doesn’t quite get down to the roots of the structural problem with the US corpocracy: The problem of companies being enthusiastically managed into...

voxday.net

From startup to giant government-supported effective monopoly, the core concept of the “company” has changed. Until the 1980s, a company was understood to be an organization that existed in order to profitably provide goods and services to its customers. But with the onset of financialization, a company became seen as a vehicle for the transfer of money from the government, from venture capitalists, or from Wall Street to the primary stakeholders. The customers were secondary, the goods and services tertiary. The existing businesses and customer bases are nothing more than mines to be stripped of all their assets, then abandoned, barren and empty.

This is why deplatforming – unthinkable in “the customer is always right era” – is now very common and the quality of the goods being produced and the services being provided is in free fall. The convergence of the corporations is rendering them totally incapable of fulfilling their nominal core functions, and combined with the financialization of the corporate sector, means they’re not even incentivized to attempt to fulfill those functions.

If Lockheed Martin can arrange to get a government contract paying $100 billion for a single jet fighter that cannot even fly, that’s great business by today’s standards. If a startup can receive $1 billion in venture capital without ever generating a single dime of income, that’s a home run by today’s standards. And yet, there is no actual economic activity. There is nothing being produced and no services provided.

In other words, it’s a fragile system with a foundation that isn’t built on sand, but thin air. Which is why it is vital for those who wish to survive, and perhaps even thrive, amidst the system’s inevitable ruins to ignore the way business is done today and focus on the age-old principles of providing genuine value to actual customers.