The Success / Destruction of Modern Men

I would be interested to hear people's thoughts about the internet and its effect on men. What are the pros and cons? Has it been a net positive or a negative for men and for society in general?

I am kinda leaning on it being a negative for men. Even excluding the effect of dating apps and porn, its way too easy to become pacified by the internet. To watch content that you agree with and to feel like being active on X is being genuinely active.

I think we forgot how to be bored and how to cope with boredom effectively. We have become mesmerised by a storm of content.

On fasting days I am thinking about switching off everything, riding out the impulse to doom scroll, purposefully do nothing until I feel genuinely bored and then read a book or do some drawing or something. I don't even know if I would manage to ride out the impulse, but I think it would be something I can train myself to do.

The issue with the internet and men is the same as internet with women. It has enabled and excused them to live garbage lives. Instead of bettering yourself in real life you go online and find people who live garbage lives just like you and make it okay for yourself. "Look these other guys live like shit and are upset about their shit lives just like me, it's okay because there are others just like me so I'm going to make my identity instead of trying to change it".

How it manifests itself is different in men than it is in women but it's the same overall issue....enabling.

The internet is poison to your real life, it should be a side thing in your life not the other way around.
 
The problem is that all of these behaviors came back. Thus, they are intrinsic to who we are as (base) human beings. You are proving my point - none of these "predispositions" actually went extinct - not sure why you don't see this.

These behaviors come back because they are tied to original sin - the tendency towards destructive behaviors and death. But, they do not come back in the same force across all races, which, for example, is why you see Whites having higher marriage rates than Blacks, so this shows that previous history has had an important impact on shaping both men and women's predispositions towards certain behaviors.

I think you get caught up in "natural section" - I don't mean it from a purely biological function, but, more like "cultural selection," whereby cultural behaviors are ingrained into groups of people over centuries which becomes a part of their instincts over millennia.

Understanding these phenomena helps to explain current behaviors - we see some trad women carrying on past behaviors, but a majority are falling to original sin, which has gotten worse each generation since the start of the post-Christian era (after WWI). Generational decline is also the message of the 10 commandments: "Your sins will be visited upon the 3rd and 4th generations."

Since these behaviors lead to death, it axiomatically follows that those who resist such trends will be the only ones left to pass on their cultural values. Hence why the Church survives.

I get that in time it will balance, but that doesn't help guys on the forum much right now, which is why we are here. Ultimately, whether you have kids or not, it is true, is not important compared to loving God and enduring to be "made well" but it's a tough aspect to deal with, the fulfillment of sex and legacy.

You must understand, that it is our cross to bear. Either hop on a plane or prepare for celibacy!
 
The internet is poison to your real life, it should be a side thing in your life not the other way around.
I think it's better stated social media, since the internet has far more good things associated with it (even though it has bad) than the "social" substitute usage of internet connection. With that caveat, I agree, of course. Obviously even with interacting and reading information all the time on the "standard internet", one can do that far too much and it should be a side thing, yes.
I think you get caught up in "natural section" - I don't mean it from a purely biological function, but, more like "cultural selection," whereby cultural behaviors are ingrained into groups of people over centuries which becomes a part of their instincts over millennia.

Understanding these phenomena helps to explain current behaviors - we see some trad women carrying on past behaviors, but a majority are falling to original sin, which has gotten worse each generation since the start of the post-Christian era (after WWI). Generational decline is also the message of the 10 commandments: "Your sins will be visited upon the 3rd and 4th generations."

Since these behaviors lead to death, it axiomatically follows that those who resist such trends will be the only ones left to pass on their cultural values. Hence why the Church survives.
I still don't find it very convincing, but I see your point a little better. My point is that humans are what they are, no matter what we do, and increasing technology and convenience is a paradox. Everyone wants a better life, but these lives generally with technology aren't making parts of our lives, major parts of them any better. But that ain't going away.
You must understand, that it is our cross to bear. Either hop on a plane or prepare for celibacy!
Indeed.
 
I would be interested to hear people's thoughts about the internet and its effect on men. What are the pros and cons? Has it been a net positive or a negative for men and for society in general?

I am kinda leaning on it being a negative for men. Even excluding the effect of dating apps and porn, its way too easy to become pacified by the internet. To watch content that you agree with and to feel like being active on X is being genuinely active.

I think we forgot how to be bored and how to cope with boredom effectively. We have become mesmerised by a storm of content.

On fasting days I am thinking about switching off everything, riding out the impulse to doom scroll, purposefully do nothing until I feel genuinely bored and then read a book or do some drawing or something. I don't even know if I would manage to ride out the impulse, but I think it would be something I can train myself to do.
For me, the internet is a net positive. Through it, I discovered Roosh, The Red Pill, and The Church. Besides those significant finds, I can access DIY videos, movie and game recommendations, and travel suggestions. This forum, for instance, enables meaningful discussions among people from all around the world through the internet.

If someone chooses to access porn or ragebait content, that's their responsibility. It's similar to disliking guns because of school shooters.

You must understand, that it is our cross to bear. Either hop on a plane or prepare for celibacy!
I hope I never have to face this "either or" scenario. I am willing to bear our cross as a Christian, but there are certain things that are off-limits, and this is one of them. Can I bear the cross? Yes. Will I? Most probably not.

I really don't want to be an incel or volcel faithmaxxer. In Red Pill terminology, a man who is not very successful in attracting women is called a beta male, while a man who is a complete failure with women is called an omega male. By this definition, a celibate man will never be an alpha. This is why I don't want to be celibate; because no matter what I do, I will never be considered an alpha.

Come hell or high water, I will find myself a beautiful woman. I often think about this: if there's a CIK forum meetup in the future, which would be better—showing up with a beautiful wife, running a successful business, well-dressed with visible abs, or showing up as a celibate priest? With this thought experiment, I believe the former is better.

Call me a dork if you want, but this is something I'm not willing to compromise on, even as a Christian.
 
I would be interested to hear people's thoughts about the internet and its effect on men. What are the pros and cons? Has it been a net positive or a negative for men and for society in general?
Godly men use it for godly purposes and devilish men use it for devilish purposes. Because humans naturally tend towards evil, the cons to the internet are well documented.
One of the biggest cons is the fractionalization of society through social media.

When you go to church, you are part of that society. In order to get along with the people in that society, you must be willing to sacrifice aspects of your own character for the sake of unity. You can't just start beefs and cut people off in church.

The illusory, virtual world is the opposite of this. You can tune out everybody who you don't want to hear, so you only see what you want to see. It's why people who are consumed by social media are so lonely and vain. They live alone in a fake world of their own creation, hearing only the things they want to hear and seeing only the things they want to see.
 
For me, the internet is a net positive. Through it, I discovered Roosh, The Red Pill, and The Church. Besides those significant finds, I can access DIY videos, movie and game recommendations, and travel suggestions. This forum, for instance, enables meaningful discussions among people from all around the world through the internet.

If someone chooses to access porn or ragebait content, that's their responsibility. It's similar to disliking guns because of school shooters.


I hope I never have to face this "either or" scenario. I am willing to bear our cross as a Christian, but there are certain things that are off-limits, and this is one of them. Can I bear the cross? Yes. Will I? Most probably not.

I really don't want to be an incel or volcel faithmaxxer. In Red Pill terminology, a man who is not very successful in attracting women is called a beta male, while a man who is a complete failure with women is called an omega male. By this definition, a celibate man will never be an alpha. This is why I don't want to be celibate; because no matter what I do, I will never be considered an alpha.

Come hell or high water, I will find myself a beautiful woman. I often think about this: if there's a CIK forum meetup in the future, which would be better—showing up with a beautiful wife, running a successful business, well-dressed with visible abs, or showing up as a celibate priest? With this thought experiment, I believe the former is better.

Call me a dork if you want, but this is something I'm not willing to compromise on, even as a Christian.

I guarantee you if Roosh showed up to CIK meetup as a celibate priest he would get more praise than being seculary succesful. Who gives a fuck if you're alpha or beta to secular NPCs?
 
I guarantee you if Roosh showed up to CIK meetup as a celibate priest he would get more praise than being seculary succesful. Who gives a fuck if you're alpha or beta to secular NPCs?
Definitely. And if you act like those "alpha" pick up guys towards a legitimate Christian woman, she will lose interest. Women that aren't damaged goods don't want men like that. Big difference between being a masculine leader, and one of those phonie alphas.
 
Definitely. And if you act like those "alpha" pick up guys towards a legitimate Christian woman, she will lose interest. Women that aren't damaged goods don't want men like that. Big difference between being a masculine leader, and one of those phonie alphas.

The terminology has been warped and twisted. Looking back, redpill thinking had a net negative effect on my life.

Younger men attach way too much meaning to sexual ‘success’ when engaging in that behavior in the long run leads to soul ruin. Nothing tangible came out of my hook up or plate spinning stage. I consider it a gigantic waste of time now, and instead tell men they should avoid it and focus on finding a good woman to marry. Of course many will disregard that advice completely like I did.

I remember watching a documentary of a rock star many years ago. He broke down in tears from massive depression because he couldn’t find a long term relationship. Back then I thought yeah right, but now I know it was genuine. I never had the extreme experience like that rockstar or Roosh did with women, but the experiences I did have left my soul more empty and jaded.

The problem with the mentality is that men will continue to always look for something better. They never accept the woman as she is and think that they should dump her for someone more beautiful or whatever. Then they get bored and move on. Not only does it damage the man’s soul, but if you do this to a good woman it damages her greatly as well (the sluts are acting this way themselves so it doesn’t matter much)

We have to be practical and for most it isn’t practical to marry the first woman you date or court. Maybe in old times with strong family structure, and society forcing it. So a few real relationships and then seriously court for a wife. But hookups, casual sex? No way. It totally degrades you.

People can call me a hypocrite for stating this while at the same time admitting I did engage in hookups in the past, but I don’t care.

The path to self knowledge isn’t always easy. Sometimes it’s a difficult and dirty path that leads you to the truth.
 
For me, the internet is a net positive. Through it, I discovered Roosh, The Red Pill, and The Church. Besides those significant finds, I can access DIY videos, movie and game recommendations, and travel suggestions. This forum, for instance, enables meaningful discussions among people from all around the world through the internet.

If someone chooses to access porn or ragebait content, that's their responsibility. It's similar to disliking guns because of school shooters.


I hope I never have to face this "either or" scenario. I am willing to bear our cross as a Christian, but there are certain things that are off-limits, and this is one of them. Can I bear the cross? Yes. Will I? Most probably not.

I really don't want to be an incel or volcel faithmaxxer. In Red Pill terminology, a man who is not very successful in attracting women is called a beta male, while a man who is a complete failure with women is called an omega male. By this definition, a celibate man will never be an alpha. This is why I don't want to be celibate; because no matter what I do, I will never be considered an alpha.

Come hell or high water, I will find myself a beautiful woman. I often think about this: if there's a CIK forum meetup in the future, which would be better—showing up with a beautiful wife, running a successful business, well-dressed with visible abs, or showing up as a celibate priest? With this thought experiment, I believe the former is better.

Call me a dork if you want, but this is something I'm not willing to compromise on, even as a Christian.


From this post and others you have made it seems you are fixated on the notion that material and superficial things are going to change who you are and lead you to happiness.

Success is great it helps you care for the people you love, so is being healthy, nice things are fine in life if that matters to you so is an attractive woman but I can assure you with complete confidence that lust, greed and vanity do not lead to happiness or fulfillment. I have had, have and can have all the things you have posted about as being your "goals" in this post and others.....trust me when I tell you that they do not change who you are or lead to some special awakening in life, they are hollow.
 
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For me, the internet is a net positive. Through it, I discovered Roosh, The Red Pill, and The Church. Besides those significant finds, I can access DIY videos, movie and game recommendations, and travel suggestions. This forum, for instance, enables meaningful discussions among people from all around the world through the internet.

If someone chooses to access porn or ragebait content, that's their responsibility. It's similar to disliking guns because of school shooters.


I hope I never have to face this "either or" scenario. I am willing to bear our cross as a Christian, but there are certain things that are off-limits, and this is one of them. Can I bear the cross? Yes. Will I? Most probably not.

I really don't want to be an incel or volcel faithmaxxer. In Red Pill terminology, a man who is not very successful in attracting women is called a beta male, while a man who is a complete failure with women is called an omega male. By this definition, a celibate man will never be an alpha. This is why I don't want to be celibate; because no matter what I do, I will never be considered an alpha.

Come hell or high water, I will find myself a beautiful woman. I often think about this: if there's a CIK forum meetup in the future, which would be better—showing up with a beautiful wife, running a successful business, well-dressed with visible abs, or showing up as a celibate priest? With this thought experiment, I believe the former is better.

Call me a dork if you want, but this is something I'm not willing to compromise on, even as a Christian.

I don't think you can apply this logic to people who pursue a monastic vocation. Mount Athos is full of very manly and masculine men. Men who would undoubtedly make good husbands if they had chosen that path.

The analysis of being a monastic as being beta fails because these are not men who tried to persue women and had no success these are men who decided that was not the path for them.

So its kinda like the difference between someone who doesn't play basketball and someone who does play it a lot and is useless at it. You can't really call the person who doesn't play basketball pathetic in the same way that you can someone who plays it and sucks at it.

I don't think you would say monastics are "beta" if you spent any time around them.
 
I don't think you can apply this logic to people who pursue a monastic vocation. Mount Athos is full of very manly and masculine men. Men who would undoubtedly make good husbands if they had chosen that path.

The analysis of being a monastic as being beta fails because these are not men who tried to persue women and had no success these are men who decided that was not the path for them.

So its kinda like the difference between someone who doesn't play basketball and someone who does play it a lot and is useless at it. You can't really call the person who doesn't play basketball pathetic in the same way that you can someone who plays it and sucks at it.

I don't think you would say monastics are "beta" if you spent any time around them.

Your definition and interpretation of the terminology is very different from his.
 
The terminology has been warped and twisted. Looking back, redpill thinking had a net negative effect on my life.

Younger men attach way too much meaning to sexual ‘success’ when engaging in that behavior in the long run leads to soul ruin. Nothing tangible came out of my hook up or plate spinning stage. I consider it a gigantic waste of time now, and instead tell men they should avoid it and focus on finding a good woman to marry. Of course many will disregard that advice completely like I did.

I remember watching a documentary of a rock star many years ago. He broke down in tears from massive depression because he couldn’t find a long term relationship. Back then I thought yeah right, but now I know it was genuine. I never had the extreme experience like that rockstar or Roosh did with women, but the experiences I did have left my soul more empty and jaded.

The problem with the mentality is that men will continue to always look for something better. They never accept the woman as she is and think that they should dump her for someone more beautiful or whatever. Then they get bored and move on. Not only does it damage the man’s soul, but if you do this to a good woman it damages her greatly as well (the sluts are acting this way themselves so it doesn’t matter much)

We have to be practical and for most it isn’t practical to marry the first woman you date or court. Maybe in old times with strong family structure, and society forcing it. So a few real relationships and then seriously court for a wife. But hookups, casual sex? No way. It totally degrades you.

People can call me a hypocrite for stating this while at the same time admitting I did engage in hookups in the past, but I don’t care.

The path to self knowledge isn’t always easy. Sometimes it’s a difficult and dirty path that leads you to the truth.

Let me spoil the surprise for you.

I did throw away any women, but after two years in the game I realized how self-destructive the player lifestyle was. I instead focused on trying to keep girls, especially any pretty ones, with the hope that I could make something work long-term with them.

10 years later what I learned was that it made no difference. Women broke up me all the same. Didn't matter how good or bad I was, didn't matter how much I spent, didn't matter how much time I gave them. Each girl had their time with me and that was that.

I slept with dozens of women, I never used alcohol with 98% of them, and I only had to break it off with 2 of them, the rest I tried to keep, Tom Brady style, but women today are completely broken and WILL dump the man no matter what. There does not seem to be any way to stop women from being self-destructive retards.

About 25% of women are good women, they get snatched up quickly (usually by age 22) and are the reason our birthrates aren't 0. The other 75% are only good for sex, and there is nothing anyone here can do about it. Only a strong conversion from God can save them.

So Josephus, unless you had one of the rare 25% of girls who are actually good wife material, chances are those girls you threw away didn't matter much at all. Don't be too hard on yourself, it's good you've come to your realization now, but let's be real. Even if you did everything right you'd probably be in the exact same position you are now.

However, I will say I have a completely clean conscious - I do not carry heavy guilt or shame, because I kept pure intentions in the dating game. The only regret I have was not spending more time trying to date women in the Church, but even in the few times I tried, I got rejected hard and fast so it was very discouraging.

So, not throwing away women comes with at least one major benefit - you won't feel the heavy shame of sin that comes with using and throwing away women. You'll have the regular shame of debauchery, which is easily forgiven and forgotten. Being a good man gets no respect from women, but it does from God.
 
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I consider it a gigantic waste of time now, and instead tell men they should avoid it and focus on finding a good woman to marry. Of course many will disregard that advice completely like I did.
Yes, it can be a waste of time, but the difference is that experience is good for men unless you are going way overboard, which might include "stealing" something special like virginity from women. This isn't very common in the last several decades for obvious reasons.
The problem with the mentality is that men will continue to always look for something better. They never accept the woman as she is and think that they should dump her for someone more beautiful or whatever. Then they get bored and move on. Not only does it damage the man’s soul, but if you do this to a good woman it damages her greatly as well (the sluts are acting this way themselves so it doesn’t matter much)
This is far more commonly a woman's characteristic, the monkey branching, though it can be a man's.
10 years later what I learned was that it made no difference. Women broke up me all the same. Didn't matter how good or bad I was, didn't matter how much I spent, didn't matter how much time I gave them. Each girl had their time with me and that was that.
Your reply is exactly what I was thinking the whole time when reading Josephus's post.
they get snatched up quickly (usually by age 22) and are the reason our birthrates aren't 0. The other 75% are only good for sex, and there is nothing anyone here can do about it. Only a strong conversion from God can save them.
Yup. I doubt it's even 25% good, to be honest, but it could be that I'm not considering all the chubbies or fatties.
Being a good man gets no respect from women, but it does from God.
Amen.

One of the tougher things about being even a successful man in modernity, especially if you are a late maturer (which can be very advantageous as you do things and achieve before you just wanna bang things all day), is that you have to be attracted to the girl to the extent you'd be like "I think I can marry this girl" WITH all the personality and energy compatibility, as well as even religion perhaps. I had a girl that if I looked at it from a bigger picture as an older guy, she was in ways tailor made but also I was never initially attracted to her - and she wasn't bad looking. That's the other problem, how many of Samseau's 25% are you meeting, and how many of those are also young/same religion/one you actually find reasonably attractive/pass the boner test?

You usually need a sample of at least double digits but I've found that you barely get 3 or 4, even. Whew, what a world we've lived in.
 
That day in February *ahem* (beginning with V) is right around the corner.

And we know what that means. Simp city mayhem is coming soon.



Season 3 Nbc GIF by Law & Order


Work Yes GIF by Offline Granny!




So what are your choices from here?

- Well, you could get in early with roses and bears and surprise her at sunset before any other women start posting even more roses and bigger bears on their instagram stories 🌹🧸
- Or you could try something creative and give her a personalised gift, shipped express from Temu 📦
- Or you could even escape and get that "interstate work trip" booked asap ✈️

But ultimately, there is only one option. Alpha Mindset.

A bit about your new Chad coach (me) -


See below for more tips 😉
 
Let me spoil the surprise for you.

I did throw away any women, but after two years in the game I realized how self-destructive the player lifestyle was. I instead focused on trying to keep girls, especially any pretty ones, with the hope that I could make something work long-term with them.

10 years later what I learned was that it made no difference. Women broke up me all the same. Didn't matter how good or bad I was, didn't matter how much I spent, didn't matter how much time I gave them. Each girl had their time with me and that was that.

I slept with dozens of women, I never used alcohol with 98% of them, and I only had to break it off with 2 of them, the rest I tried to keep, Tom Brady style, but women today are completely broken and WILL dump the man no matter what. There does not seem to be any way to stop women from being self-destructive retards.

About 25% of women are good women, they get snatched up quickly (usually by age 22) and are the reason our birthrates aren't 0. The other 75% are only good for sex, and there is nothing anyone here can do about it. Only a strong conversion from God can save them.

So Josephus, unless you had one of the rare 25% of girls who are actually good wife material, chances are those girls you threw away didn't matter much at all. Don't be too hard on yourself, it's good you've come to your realization now, but let's be real. Even if you did everything right you'd probably be in the exact same position you are now.

However, I will say I have a completely clean conscious - I do not carry heavy guilt or shame, because I kept pure intentions in the dating game. The only regret I have was not spending more time trying to date women in the Church, but even in the few times I tried, I got rejected hard and fast so it was very discouraging.

So, not throwing away women comes with at least one major benefit - you won't feel the heavy shame of sin that comes with using and throwing away women. You'll have the regular shame of debauchery, which is easily forgiven and forgotten. Being a good man gets no respect from women, but it does from God.

Oh yes, I did try to keep some of them. It usually did not work out. There was one that I dated for a long time, she was a good person, but still the cultural mind virus was taking it’s hold no matter what I did.

If a woman is broken, there is nothing you can do. Outside of a St. Mary of Egypt type conversion, she should not put herself in any dating pool. Look at famous men like Tom Brady that go through divorces despite literally having everything a woman could want. If a man chooses poorly, it’s over.

I agree with @Blade Runner that the 25% number is generous. I’d say maybe 5% overall. It’s possible that for women under 25 that number is 25%, but as women age and don’t marry it begins to decline sharply.

The thing about pleasing God is that it is a much more simple life (although simple does not equal easy) It is very regimented and you know your true north. You are not swayed by the culture.

Like one of the sayings from a group of ascetic monks: “Stat crux dum volvitur orbis”

Or the cross is steady while the world turns.
 
Amen.

One of the tougher things about being even a successful man in modernity, especially if you are a late maturer (which can be very advantageous as you do things and achieve before you just wanna bang things all day), is that you have to be attracted to the girl to the extent you'd be like "I think I can marry this girl" WITH all the personality and energy compatibility, as well as even religion perhaps.

This is another sticking point. Things have to be just right to really connect. That is one of the insidious effects of multiculturalism.

My guess is a certain portion of men on this forum that are in America may be 1st/2nd generation immigrants or still have familial connections to countries that are overwhelmingly Catholic or Orthodox. Even going so far as having relatives growing up warning them about American women.

In this case the behavior of American or western women just doesn’t work at all. No matter how hard you try to adapt, those forces that shaped you reject them outright. This is, at least partially, the impetus for going abroad.


I had a girl that if I looked at it from a bigger picture as an older guy, she was in ways tailor made but also I was never initially attracted to her - and she wasn't bad looking. That's the other problem, how many of Samseau's 25% are you meeting, and how many of those are also young/same religion/one you actually find reasonably attractive/pass the boner test?

The percentages are low in my experience.


You usually need a sample of at least double digits but I've found that you barely get 3 or 4, even. Whew, what a world we've lived in.
 
I agree with @Blade Runner that the 25% number is generous. I’d say maybe 5% overall. It’s possible that for women under 25 that number is 25%, but as women age and don’t marry it begins to decline sharply.
Yes, J and I have talked about this, and I think he is correct here. The sticking point is that the only real women that matter end up being the young ones, no matter which way you look at it. I was telling a friend today, there's no point for a man who is 35-50 even, to commit to some woman older than 32, since it ends up being closer to just a cross your fingers for kids or companion relationship, anyway. The reason I say this is because although they can theoretically still have kids then, they have low energy, you didn't get their youth or looks, and that is even now markedly limited (with sex in general) by menopause.

And I just don't understand the companion thing. I'll just wait until I'm 60, they still tend to talk too much and harrass you even when you're older - I've seen it in other couples, but at least most of those had already had kids (maybe why they remarried an old woman? just used to it?).
This is another sticking point. Things have to be just right to really connect. That is one of the insidious effects of multiculturalism.
I mentioned this recently in another post/place. The "no one is religious" thing can help, but then it creates higher volumes of pairs that are less strong. It turned out that didn't really even happen, the every man for himself and civic "we're all in it for freedom and ideas" ended up just making for a society where women ruled the roost more and more. That's finally changing but it's sacrificing about 30 years of men and women in the process, at least.
In this case the behavior of American or western women just doesn’t work at all. No matter how hard you try to adapt, those forces that shaped you reject them outright. This is, at least partially, the impetus for going abroad.
I have what people would consider old parents. What I know from older America and how women were raised long ago but not that long ago, just makes it harder to square any connection, especially due to the crowding and so many older women now. I'm just going to "explain" to a woman that she shouldn't be working and that the (her) world is a lie? LOL, good luck with that, dudes.
 
I agree with @Blade Runner that the 25% number is generous. I’d say maybe 5% overall. It’s possible that for women under 25 that number is 25%, but as women age and don’t marry it begins to decline sharply.

While there is no way to know for sure, I think the 25% number is accurate, nationwide. The problem is that the nation is VERY different, as America is huge continent. For the left coast or the northeast, the marriageable women probably IS only 5%. But, in the South, where women are far more trad and religious, the number is probably around 45%.

So remember, nationwide averages aren't going to describe an individual's experience.
 
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