Is it Worth Busting Your Ass in a Career?

D

Douglas Quaid

Orthodox Inquirer
Heritage
I'm starting to think it's only worth putting in long hours and investing all this time and energy (at work and outside of work) if you're an entrepreneur. Outside of this, most people in managerial/upper level positions and working for someone else are absolutely miserable. The amount of bs they have to put up with is insane. It trickles down to everyone else and I'm at a point where I want to get out before it's too late. I'm sure entrepreneurship has its own problems too, but the potential rewards and freedom at least seem worth any headaches.

Otherwise I'm totally content finding a less stressful job topping out at $30-40/hr, clock in/clock out and never think about work when you're off. Just learn how to be content with less and enjoy life.

Maybe I've had bad luck with jobs. Maybe this is how it's always been, or just a sign of the times.
 
Depends on what you want in life. If you're content to just be comfortable clocking out at 5 and taking your sick/vacation days then good on you for being content but don't ever complain that someone has more than you, you don't have that right you chose the easy way(not saying you would). If you want more you have to work for it and it's not always going to be easy, you have to make sacrifices in the short term until you get to a point where you can let off the gas and I don't necessarily mean working for a company doing more for no reason, you have to use that as a stepping stone if that is your only option.

There is also a pride element to it, something which is entirely lacking in the younger generation. At my business where I had the most employees my hardest workers were two older guys both off the boat, one significantly older than every other employee both older than myself. They were paid the same amount to start, later on we paid them more to retain them, but even from the beginning they worked harder than the young guys. To them it was a pride thing they never wanted anyone to be able to say they weren't hard workers. A different generation from a different culture.


I'm down a business at the moment I lost in a fire and while I could certainly live off my other business and just deal with the insurance that's not enough for me. I have people I care about that I need to make proud and take care of. I have been scouring the earth searching far and wide this summer for my next business endeavor traveling a lot and pretty much letting everyone court me as "free agent", a crazy wide range of businesses. I have a couple strong things I'm working on after weeding through a bunch of duds but it's still incredibly frustrating and even depressing to me not having direction yet.
 
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Busting my ass has worked great for me, in every job I've had I've crushed it by putting in the hours and doing the things no one else wants to do.

That said... If I wasn't being paid very generously and seeing the fruits of my labor I doubt I'd be pushing so hard.

But it's been my experience that in all things, the more you put in, the more you get out.

Obviously if your job has no upside, then yeah you're gonna be miserable... But as long as you're enjoying your work, then you're effectively getting paid to do something new.

In my post military career I've gotten to travel the world, go on and off shore, manage hurricane evacuations, manage large contracts of high visibility nature, develop 5 and 10 year strategy initiatives and been rewarded very handsomely in financial compensation and job opportunities.

I wake up every day excited about work.

Wasn't always that way, I've been caught in a company that was sold and got layed off before (common in upstream oil and gas) which sucks, but I still always did as much as I could to make my boss look good.

Eventually you get reputation and your boss's boss goes to you directly. That's when you know you're in and can leverage street cred to work yourself into a new position and leapfrog your boss.

Bottom line..It just depends on what you want.

If you want to be an executive in a fortune 100 company (my goal) you have to play the game and bust your ass. And not be risk adverse in taking bold moves that are calculated.

If you just want to have a "work life balance" then you do the things you want to do and you do your job, don't drop balls, but don't overcommit yourself of work later than you have to.
 
The answer will be different for every man, because we're all made and wired differently in this regard. Not everyone is cut out to be a hard-charging executive or entrepreneur. Obviously, the world would not function with all Chiefs and no Indians. This is why the ancients placed such emphasis on first knowing yourself, because only when you know yourself - meaning that you are very aware of your desires, inclinations, strengths and weaknesses - can you seek the unique path that you are ideally suited to walk.

That being said, as in most things in life, finding a balanced approach is usually best. You want a stable career that pays well, but not one that's so demanding that it will inevitably destroy your body and mind with stress and long hours. So I think the best bet for most men in the modern world is simply trying to acquire knowledge, skills and experience that are valuable to others. Help people and companies solve problems. Learn how to build/repair things that the market demands. Run toward difficult and challenging work that others avoid. If you can do those things, you will never lack for money and will, over time, likely find employment opportunities that are quite comfortable.
 
Douglas Quaid said:
I'm starting to think it's only worth putting in long hours and investing all this time and energy (at work and outside of work) if you're an entrepreneur. Outside of this, most people in managerial/upper level positions and working for someone else are absolutely miserable. The amount of bs they have to put up with is insane. It trickles down to everyone else and I'm at a point where I want to get out before it's too late. I'm sure entrepreneurship has its own problems too, but the potential rewards and freedom at least seem worth any headaches.

Otherwise I'm totally content finding a less stressful job topping out at $30-40/hr, clock in/clock out and never think about work when you're off. Just learn how to be content with less and enjoy life.

Maybe I've had bad luck with jobs. Maybe this is how it's always been, or just a sign of the times.
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Taking time off reveals a lot about your employer. A good card to play.

When it comes to money it's so much about creating margin, or balance.....and that always has to do with time.

What is my margin between earning and spending time with my kids?
earning vs saving money?
income vs debt?
needs vs wants?

If you can answer those questions you're off to a great future. Best of luck!
 
Lots of factors to consider. Are you providing for a family or will you just be hustling for yourself? What is the nature of your work? Are you working unto the glory of God?

Personally, I am content knowing that there are many things that I will not be able to do in my life. Due to money constraints, time constraints, whatever.

I believe work can be made an idol of, which is almost blasphemous to say in our current context. My trust is in Jesus Christ and His will for my life, I only ask that He teaches me to be content with His will.
 
It depends on what type of a personality you are. If you like the feeling of security, stability, and routine, then you are an employee.
If you like unpredictability, constant learning, and are adaptable to sudden changes, then you are an entrepreneur.

Shit could happen, and will in both instances, the difference is, in the latter, you are king of it, and own it fully.
 
Work for yourself. Why would you want to put up with a boss? Schedules etc. Looll. You will still have a boss which is the government (besides God). But it´s the only person who still gives you orders. In the beginning it´s hard. But after a while it goes into navigation mode. Than you put people dealing with people. And you just manage. Being a good enterpreneur is a lot of HR. After a while you just give orders. Managing people kinda sucks. But it´s better than dealing with a boss. If you do investments (real estate, stocks, etc). You don´t manage people and make money. The downside is social isolation. But with family it´s irrelevant.

Unless you work for the government there is no such thing as job security. I remember people talked about banks. Working in a bank was a job for life. Now bankers are real estate brokers. Retards.
 
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Be hard on yourself here:

Where do you fall in the talent and industrious categories? Talented but lazy = stay corporate, play the game, work smart, never let them know how much you are shamming off, enjoy the perks. Talented and always industrious = start your own business, deal with the pain. Untalented and lazy = be glad you get paid for anything. Untalented and industrious = keep grinding, maybe something will work out.

Please note, the "talent" threshold is not "PhD Petroleum Engineering" or such. There are UPS drivers pulling 150k. They may have the swing shift, but it pays well. There are hustlers out there washing windows making even more. Their talent is focused performance.

If you are talented and industrious, a career is not worth it, unless you are exceptionally well-paid. The kind of money where you and your wife giggle and ask what to do with it all. I never got there in career work.
 
Pointy Elbows said:
Be hard on yourself here:

Where do you fall in the talent and industrious categories? Talented but lazy = stay corporate, play the game, work smart, never let them know how much you are shamming off, enjoy the perks. Talented and always industrious = start your own business, deal with the pain. Untalented and lazy = be glad you get paid for anything. Untalented and industrious = keep grinding, maybe something will work out.

Please note, the "talent" threshold is not "PhD Petroleum Engineering" or such. There are UPS drivers pulling 150k. They may have the swing shift, but it pays well. There are hustlers out there washing windows making even more. Their talent is focused performance.

If you are talented and industrious, a career is not worth it, unless you are exceptionally well-paid. The kind of money where you and your wife giggle and ask what to do with it all. I never got there in career work.
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I think this is pretty accurate for most people.

Salary is largely dependent on industry norm, time in field and unique skills you offer.

A 150k salary is upper end for a lot of people at many companies, but barely mid career if you're on the right tract at a large firm.

If you run your own business, you might not have that high a salary but you can expense a lot of items and creatively avoid taxes. My parents provided us a very very lavish life relative to the money they paid themselves out of the business. But my old man at 72 still works harder physically than most men do in their youth. It's a hard but rewarding endeavor.
 
I think this question can be asked from so many angles...

"Is it worth it to bust your ass, will you get rewarded?" Truly depends on what field you go into and where you work. With diversity quotas increasing, it will be harder and harder for a lot of hard working me to find rewards for hard work. Just the reality of things. IT is being flooded and destroyed with H-1B visa workers. It really depends on who you work for and what you do. If you are not rewarded for it, then slow down work and take your time back, to hell with them.

"Is it worth it to bust your ass, philosophically?". I would say "no". Most people I see climb to the top lose themselves. They look weak and fragile, they constantly have to walk on egg shells to not offend anyone, they have no real confidence in themselves because their confidence is based on a job that could disappear tomorrow. They have to push marxist rhetoric in the company and they know all the decent men below them have no respect for them, at best, and at worst are just waiting for an opportunity to get back at you. They waste their day in boring meeting, after boring meeting, and truly never have power, that is left in the hands of Blackrock and their friends on Wall Street. And realistically, how much longer can this fraud system hold up, with Russia and China dunking on us? Enjoy your life and go after what you really want, the old days of "being successful" "having to be married with kids by a certain age" are all long gone. Until our society becomes normal again, they are not coming back.

Is it worth it to bust your ass, start your own business, do your own thing? I would say "yes" if it is a true passion of yours or "Yes" if you have inside connections to make a lot of money. Otherwise, I wouldn't suggest trying to run a small business in an economy run by and for Wall Street.

We are sort of like the new Soviet Union. Those with the best lives, live only for today, don't try to advance or work hard or even work, and they still live a life quality as good as most of those who do work, with all the time in the world to do whatever they want and be free to learn/explore/rest.
 
Don't be the guy that stays after 5 to please your boss. That's just pride.
a. The will never be pleased.
b. You are just asking for more responsibility with the same pay.
c. You are wasting your time to make another man richer.
d. You set a bad precedent for your co-workers.
e. You are stealing from yourself. Work for your own business or devote more time to family and hobbies.

If you're 9-5, the best course is to stay below the radar and enjoy your improved work-life balance with the same or slightly less pay for much less responsibilities. Let other men waste away their body and time while their masters reap the benefits.
 
KomnenAl said:
Don't be the guy that stays after 5 to please your boss. That's just pride.
a. The will never be pleased.
b. You are just asking for more responsibility with the same pay.
c. You are wasting your time to make another man richer.
d. You set a bad precedent for your co-workers.
e. You are stealing from yourself. Work for your own business or devote more time to family and hobbies.

If you're 9-5, the best course is to stay below the radar and enjoy your improved work-life balance with the same or slightly less pay for much less responsibilities. Let other men waste away their body and time while their masters reap the benefits.
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I’ve seen the opposite. Before you work hard you have dictate your terms to your boss. Guys like that actually get preferential treatment and their work is actually valued. That’s why managers usually probe into your personal life. Oh you’re single? Oh you’re retarded? I guess you won’t mind overtime. You need to make sure your work knows you have other responsibilities and you’re there to do the actual job you were hired for, nothing more, nothing less. Anything else is a BIG request that needs to be run by you with incentives.

You think your boss wants to have that conversation where your bark back? Where a line was crossed and you’re justifiably upset? No, he’ll ask the next guy.

Nothing better than having losers working for you that you can push around. They keep their head down, you have no idea why they show up for work in the first place, and you can ask the most ridiculous requests and get some retarded response “Oh you want me to unclog the toilet? Okay I guess… since you say there’s no one else”.
 
Douglas Quaid said:
I'm starting to think it's only worth putting in long hours and investing all this time and energy (at work and outside of work) if you're an entrepreneur. Outside of this, most people in managerial/upper level positions and working for someone else are absolutely miserable. The amount of bs they have to put up with is insane. It trickles down to everyone else and I'm at a point where I want to get out before it's too late. I'm sure entrepreneurship has its own problems too, but the potential rewards and freedom at least seem worth any headaches.

Otherwise I'm totally content finding a less stressful job topping out at $30-40/hr, clock in/clock out and never think about work when you're off. Just learn how to be content with less and enjoy life.

Maybe I've had bad luck with jobs. Maybe this is how it's always been, or just a sign of the times.
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I have come to the same conclusion as you.

With the same effort, time and resources expended being an entrepreneur will almost always delivers more returns compared to working hard for someone else.

Plus we must remember that working in a career is not as easy and straightforward as we thought. If it is going to be complicated either way, then it will be better if we go an extra mile and just start our own business.
  • Does working in career guarantee you a 9-5 work hour? In my experience it is not, most people are expected to stay for at least half an hour after 5. In my old firm there is even an unwritten rule that any hour before 22:00 is not treated as an overtime.
  • Working hard in a career does not mean we will get rewarded for it. I've seen with my own eyes that hard worker does get promoted and get a small pay increase, but their workload increase exponentially until many of them burned out and resigned anyway.
  • Despite workers being entitled for leave, it is usually very challenging to get your leave approved. Even if it gets approved and you are literally on leave, your superiors will most probably still ask you about your work.
  • Being in off hours after 17:00 or in weekends, you will probably be contacted for work, so we never really sign-off from work. I personally experienced suddenly getting an assignment on Thursday evening at 19:00 and on Saturday morning at 10:00.
  • Observe that in all business both multinational, national, regional, small, whatever it is, the richest person in that business is always the owner. It is logical that being a business owner will eventually out earn any career hard-worker.
Thanks OP for starting this thread, I've been wondering about this question myself for a long time. Lots of red pills dropped by members here. This makes me want to double down starting my own business ASAP.
 
Working "after hours" only lowers your selfesteem and it's a trick by them to wipe out competition as you won't have that time to spend on yourself so don't do it.

That said; you need to sort of use them the way they use you, so invest everything you've got left and live frugal and don't buy cars etc.
 
if anyone has ever read Rich Dad Poor Dad, there is an obvious benefit to being a business owner.

But there is also a benefit of being an employee is that you can check out when you aren't at work. Constantly being "on" as a business owner is a real problem if you don't set boundaries. There is something to be said for a consistent paycheck when raising a family.

There are also plenty of careers in which you can become self employed that allow a lot of flexibility. Careers such as dentists, doctors and lawyers come to mind.
 
As others have said in different words:

If you are in a situation with high opportunity, it's worth it to put in the work.

And the corollary:

If you are in a situation with low opportunity, two options:
1. Do the minimum, live with average pay
2. Find better opportunities

At least the West still has great financial opportunities.
 
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