The (Leaving The) European Union Thread

Caduceus said:
Rich western counties that are NOT part of the European Union:

United Kingdom
Switzerland
Iceland
Norway

Countries that might leave the EU in the future:

Hungary


Poland

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Presumably there will be severe issues in the Eurozone and an explosion of terrorism and civil unrest in Europe when a recession hits. Not that there isn't already one in real terms. And Italy and Greece have shrunk since 2008. That would be a good time for campaigns to leave the EU to be unleashed. It would be wise to be realistic. I saw a poll from about 2016 that showed a 10% majority of Dutch would vote to leave the EU, but not the single market. That might go down well in several countries, when the EU is reeling.
 
Cynllo said:
Presumably there will be severe issues in the Eurozone and an explosion of terrorism and civil unrest in Europe when a recession hits. Not that there isn't already one in real terms. And Italy and Greece have shrunk since 2008. That would be a good time for campaigns to leave the EU to be unleashed. It would be wise to be realistic. I saw a poll from about 2016 that showed a 10% majority of Dutch would vote to leave the EU, but not the single market. That might go down well in several countries, when the EU is reeling.
Click to expand...
Caduceus said:
Rich western counties that are NOT part of the European Union:

United Kingdom
Switzerland
Iceland
Norway

Countries that might leave the EU in the future:

Hungary


Poland

Click to expand...
Poland and Hungary have millions of their citizens living and working in EU member states in Western Europe. An exit from from the EU would be disastrous for them.
No to mention, both countries get generous amounts os money from EU Development funds.
 
cognitive dissonance 73 said:
Poland and Hungary have millions of their citizens living and working in EU member states in Western Europe. An exit from from the EU would be disastrous for them.
No to mention, both countries get generous amounts os money from EU Development funds.
Click to expand...

Hungary gets about 2.5% of GDP from the EU, which it attempts to use to get Hungary to follow a left-wing agenda. The EU is a permanent left-wing body, where even the former head of Euro conservatives (Juncker) celebrated the birthday of Karl Marx. I'm not sure what your positions are. But you said you are for traditional families in another thread. Hungary is the only family-centric state in Europe, and probably one of the few in the world. The EU is against that. It's anti-family and promoted pronouns and all the rest of it.

Hungary is criticised by them as not being democratic. Ignoring that the EU is undemocratic, all Hungary does is use power to entrench itself. The EU and all its clients states use power to entrench permanent wall-to-wall left-wing institutions.

Why are you posting here? All your positions seem to be left-wing, and don't add up.
 
Cynllo said:
Hungary gets about 2.5% of GDP from the EU, which it attempts to use to get Hungary to follow a left-wing agenda. The EU is a permanent left-wing body, where even the former head of Euro conservatives (Juncker) celebrated the birthday of Karl Marx. I'm not sure what your positions are. But you said you are for traditional families in another thread. Hungary is the only family-centric state in Europe, and probably one of the few in the world. The EU is against that. It's anti-family and promoted pronouns and all the rest of it.

Hungary is criticised by them as not being democratic. Ignoring that the EU is undemocratic, all Hungary does is use power to entrench itself. The EU and all its clients states use power to entrench permanent wall-to-wall left-wing institutions.

Why are you posting here? All your positions seem to be left-wing, and don't add up.
Click to expand...
The statement was factual - you did not bring in any information that would prove it isn't.
Yet, you get back with a political rant. Go, tell the 4 million Poles and the 1 millions Hungarians that they are idiots for living in the West.. See what you will tell you. In fact, why don't you and some of the guys from this site move to Poland or Hungary?
You constantly belittle the West ...but none of you has made it uet to your imaginary "paradizes" in Eastern Europe. We all know the answer why.
We have been throught this before in relation to Russia: what the state propaganda machine says...and what the reality on the ground if are quiet different.
I am done here.
You can ban me form this site, if you wish.
 
Caduceus said:
Countries that might leave the EU in the future:

Hungary

Click to expand...

Hungary will stay a EU member as long as they have net gains from their membership. But the moment their financial contributions over exceed the EU funds, they will, most likely, pack their bags and leave.


Caduceus said:
Poland

Click to expand...

Poland had elections a month ago, which the eurosceptic government had lost. The incoming liberal government will be pro-EU with everything that it entails.
Fun fact - Ann Applebaum's husband - Mr Sikorsky (first person to congratulate America for blowing up Nord Stream) will once again serve as minister of foreign affairs.
 
cognitive dissonance 73 said:
You can ban me form this site, if you wish.
Click to expand...

giphy.gif
 
OP set a juicy click-bait trap for @cognitive dissonance 73. Saw this thread title and thought - no way that brother's gonna miss this one. Only to find him defending the EU. Plus a bonus gif.

Thread delivers.

On topic, the EU does seem to have a surprisingly large support from member populations. The few Europeans I talk to about it really hammer on about the freedom of travel, etc. There is almost no awareness of the loss of national sovereignty/identity to a Brussels bureaucracy. Is that the general observation that European members have?
 
Eastern-Euro countries are only in the EU for the "free" money. Of course the EU try to make them gay, but that will fail in the end. I do blame nations like Hungary and Poland for not practicing what they preach though. They could leave, but they take the free money, which is sort of exploiting the western-European citizens.
 
Pointy Elbows said:
OP set a juicy click-bait trap for @cognitive dissonance 73. Saw this thread title and thought - no way that brother's gonna miss this one. Only to find him defending the EU. Plus a bonus gif.

Thread delivers.

On topic, the EU does seem to have a surprisingly large support from member populations. The few Europeans I talk to about it really hammer on about the freedom of travel, etc. There is almost no awareness of the loss of national sovereignty/identity to a Brussels bureaucracy. Is that the general observation that European members have?
Click to expand...
Yes, they all talk about freedom of travel, but seem to forget travel throughout europe was relatively hassle free pre-EU.
 
cognitive dissonance 73 said:
Poland and Hungary have millions of their citizens living and working in EU member states in Western Europe. An exit from from the EU would be disastrous for them.
No to mention, both countries get generous amounts os money from EU Development funds.
Click to expand...
I can agree to an extent. A lot of these eastern block European seem to be decently dependent on their status as an EU nation. Having the ability to send you citizens and work in any one of the EU countries to make money and bring it back to the homeland is same tactic that Hispanics have been doing in the US since the 70s. My old bullion dealer was making a living here in the US and recently moved back to Poland, I highly doubt it would have been such an easy move to come to the US if Poland wasn't a part of the EU. And free money just by being a member is also a plus for these developing nations.

Personally, I don't think that these countries will benefit in the long-run with continued membership.
 
Pointy Elbows said:
OP set a juicy click-bait trap for @cognitive dissonance 73. Saw this thread title and thought - no way that brother's gonna miss this one. Only to find him defending the EU. Plus a bonus gif.

Thread delivers.

On topic, the EU does seem to have a surprisingly large support from member populations. The few Europeans I talk to about it really hammer on about the freedom of travel, etc. There is almost no awareness of the loss of national sovereignty/identity to a Brussels bureaucracy. Is that the general observation that European members have?
Click to expand...
Honestly didn’t intend to set up a “click bait” trap. That user wasn’t even in my radar.
 
TheSurveyor said:
I can agree to an extent. A lot of these eastern block European seem to be decently dependent on their status as an EU nation. Having the ability to send you citizens and work in any one of the EU countries to make money and bring it back to the homeland is same tactic that Hispanics have been doing in the US since the 70s. My old bullion dealer was making a living here in the US and recently moved back to Poland, I highly doubt it would have been such an easy move to come to the US if Poland wasn't a part of the EU. And free money just by being a member is also a plus for these developing nations.

Personally, I don't think that these countries will benefit in the long-run with continued membership.
Click to expand...
Poland has found a way to make it worthwhile though. They get a bunch of tourists visiting, EU money, Polish people can work around Europe conveniently etc.

But, at the same time, they've avoided migrant influxes. I think even the most conservative brits or Germans would happily accept a deal like that for their own countries.
 
Brexit was a red herring and a negative for stay at home Brits in terms of rising costs as well as increased immigration from the third world. And, for those of us who put our money where our mouth is and left it's also caused a list of both financial and bureaucratic headaches. There were zero benefits for anyone except financers and careerist politicians and I warned about it in 2016 on RVF and got shouted down for it.

A pan European, fortress Europa style union led by the Orban's, Konfederacja's and Le Pen's of the continent is probably much more beneficial to the average person than Farage and his ilk and their petty bulldog nationalism.

Cog dis is also correct about Poland and Hungary. They throw spanners in the works of the more socially progressive policies, but the financial benefits they receive have transformed them into incredibly nice first-world places to live (nicer than their Western European counterparts in infrastructure in some areas). They'll never leave until that dries up. It would be nonsensical.

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