The China Thread

[Cooper]

What planet do you people live on? There is no private property in China, you lease from the CCP for 70-99 years. The leases are violated by eminent domain there at least as much as the USA, and they do send kungfu panda off-world kick murder squads to evict people who get uppity, sometimes resulting in 100 person brawls with a few fatalities when SUVs are used to mow people down.

To my knowledge, there is no inheritance tax in China, so your progeny will inherit your property tax-free, not the case in many western countries, and even where you can inherit property tax-free, you still have to go through expensive notary and estate planning services. I doubt that in 22nd century China the second or third generation would be evicted or repossessed once those theoretical leases expire, China being a nation of homeowners.

I would much, much rather have that Chinese system, than have to pay around 1.25% annual tax on the values of my properties. Paying that percentage, that rises every few years with each reassessment, over a period of 99 years is equivalent to losing a big chunk of your property, given the power of compound interest.

As well property taxes result in millions of older retirees being forced out of their homes and having to relocate to cheaper areas because they can't afford to pay these taxes every year.

 

[LaAguilaNegra]

What planet do you people live on? There is no private property in China, you lease from the CCP for 70-99 years. The leases are violated by eminent domain there at least as much as the USA, and they do send kungfu panda off-world kick murder squads to evict people who get uppity, sometimes resulting in 100 person brawls with a few fatalities when SUVs are used to mow people down.

Nail houses exist in small jurisdictions that are incompetent at hiring thugs to throw people off their land, which is normal in China, where almost nothing is enforced with uniformity except gutter oil quotas. If you search China+forced+evictions you'll see endless cases.

1 minute clip that gives a little idea. The old videos that showed the big brawls are no longer to be found online.



One of the most spectacular cases without a fatality was in Wuhan 2009 when the property lessee built a make-shift cannon with fireworks and a crude tower from which to defend against the attackers, a battle that raged on and off for monthses.

View attachment 25222

Eventually, they injured him.

View attachment 25223

Running after Lil Coop scooping up turd after turd is tiresome and practically a full time day job. Good on you that you have the willpower to pick out one or two lies a time, many would prefer to just let it slide and frankly I don't blame them. Comrade Coop is fully dedicated to spreading falsehoods and fake narratives day after day after day after day than this man, totally not sus hand on my heart

You're right about everything else. Aside from Xi nobody 'owns' anything in China. All property is on lease from the central authority ergo you are allowed to have certain things for a fixed period of time provided you are carrying water for the communist party. This leasing system is a gigantic hot potato, a bit like the hukou system, because there currently is no system or law on regulated extension, leading to exorbitant fees (300-400 percent value price to renew) in a few SH cases already. There also isn't a guarantee the asset can be handed over to your descendent, double the fun. Third point: mortgages cannot be canceled even when losing the main income stream, Changs cannot can't declare personal bankruptcy ergo the burden will remain on you and your name (though apparently there is something in the works to change this).

In all the muck there is one glimmer of truth though, which is that the Chinese invest in property disproportionately - although the 70 percent homeownership bull is obviously yet another fake CCP statistic. Some more Xi-onomics: due to Xi's housing overturn few years ago Chinese real estate has been losing value at a steady pace and many leasers would now have to take a 20-35 percent loss if they'd choose get rid of the asset. Gold is the Chinese's only investment option left, everything else is losing value (housing market) , stagnant (Chinese stock market), heavily restricted (forex, foreign stock markets), or prohibited (bitcoin).

 

[Eagle3]

The Chinese didn't invent technologies like high-speed rail, thorium-powered nuclear plants, solar panels etc, but they are good at taking STEALING these foreign techs, improving them and implementing them on a massive scale.

There. I fixed it for you.

 

[Sandalwood Peak]

It appears China suffers from the same civilizational dynamics that are present in the West.

I you're out in the countryside, trying to live off the land, or being a good factory boy, the bureaucrats will hang you out to dry, when you get in their way or get yourself into trouble.

If you'll living in the middle of Shanghai, working at an engineering firm, then life is good. Enormous clean gyms, fancy restaurants, fingerprint payments, robot vacuums, an EV in the underground garage, etc.

You can say "I've been to the outskirts" and it's totally fine. Yeah, it's like that in every country. It's fine until it's not. It's good until you run into problems.

I think it's fair to say that the measure of a civilization is how it's able to rectify this problem and create a system that offers dignity to the most amount of people. Traditionally the wealth the Chinese have acquired could have a spurred a revolution of thought, to drive societal change for the better. Unfortunately, the Chinese are victims of the times just like we are. Communism being both a benefit and hindrance in this regard.

What I'm personally interested is whether the Chinese are able to revolutionize their way of thinking. Obviously, the lack of migrants gives them an immeasurable advantage over white people. Their centralized government is most likely preventing the consequences of the stupidity of their populace, who would fully embrace liberalism given the chance. Unfortunately, communism is also causing some ideological stagnation to a very serious degree and an over reliance on outdated boomerism that the world takes as gospel.

We're not in an economic war with the Chinese, we're in a void of dignity war with the Chinese. Which one of us can stop being a faggot first? The white man knows he's a faggot but does the Chinaman? That knowing is what gives the Whiteman a hidden advantage. It would be wise to take notice.

Their industrial capacity is buying them time, and I do hope it will continue to do so, but supreme faggotry will have its comeuppance in the long run for all of us.

 

[Australia Sucks]

In the West, you can kill millions of people by forcing them to take toxic vaccines that mutate their DNA, and do it out in the open, because the general public is brainwashed.

You really want to have this Covid discussion again?

China locked down the whole country and sent the military out to keep people locked up inside their apartment towers and locked down whole cities because a few people had COVID.

China was very draconian during COVID just a different style of draconian to the west. Stop simping for China.

 

[Australia Sucks]

A lot had changed especially since their GDP had increased 4-5% about every year in that decade.

We have had this discussion before. A lot of the Chinese GDP is fake and done just to pump up the numbers. Building ghost cities, uneconomical bullet trains to small cities, having huge amounts of greenery in the middle of nowhere along the highway that have to be watered and maintained etc.

You can see the data that growth in electricity usage and other key metrics don’t gel with the stated GDP growth metrics.

 

[Cooper]

You really want to have this Covid discussion again?
China locked down the whole country and sent the military out to keep people locked up inside their apartment towers and locked down whole cities because a few people had COVID.

China was very draconian during COVID just a different style of draconian to the west. Stop simping for China.

Would you rather have gone through a draconian temporary lockdown as in some cities in China, or have your genes and those of your family permanently mutated by the mRNA poison, your organs damaged, cancer risks spiked??

We have had this discussion before. A lot of the Chinese GDP is fake and done just to pump up the numbers. Building ghost cities, uneconomical bullet trains to small cities, having huge amounts of greenery in the middle of nowhere along the highway that have to be watered and maintained etc.

You can see the data that growth in electricity usage and other key metrics don’t gel with the stated GDP growth metrics.

Instead of just relying on shoddy sources, check for yourself before posting. You're very misinformed on the Chinese economy because that is a very basic data point that any China observer knows.

https://www.visualcapitalist.com/charted-chinas-energy-needs-keep-on-rising

A lot of the Chinese GDP is fake

Look up "imputed rent", or estimated rental value of owner-occupied housing. Imputed rents represent trillions of dollars in fudged numbers on the GDP of the US, UK, Canada among other countries. The Chinese GDP figures don't include imputed rents.

That imputed rents figure alone represents a fudge factor of 8%-12% in GDP growth figures.

How much of Canada's GDP is imputed rent?
Imputed Rent's Significant Contribution to Canadian GDP

Over the past year, imputed rent from owner-occupied housing accounted for a remarkable 12.5% of real GDP growth. This means that more than one in ten dollars of Canada's reported economic expansion stemmed from this non-cash component.Aug 7, 2025

 

[Cooper]

You're right about everything else. Aside from Xi nobody 'owns' anything in China. All property is on lease from the central authority ergo you are allowed to have certain things for a fixed period of time provided you are carrying water for the communist party.

You're not carrying water for the communist party simply because you're not paying anything to the communist party as a property owner. Whereas in the West you will always be a renter to some extent as you have to pay the government property taxes on your home or land.

As well you didn't mention capital gains on property, in China there are none on primary residence held over 5 years.

Most of the info you post about China is unsourced and fake, you have a very limited knowledge of Chinese culture and politics as an outsider who has not had significant experiences and travels in China and east Asia. .

This leasing system is a gigantic hot potato, a bit like the hukou system, because there currently is no system or law on regulated extension, leading to exorbitant fees (300-400 percent value price to renew) in a few SH cases already. There also isn't a guarantee the asset can be handed over to your descendent, double the fun. Third point: mortgages cannot be canceled even when losing the main income stream, Changs cannot can't declare personal bankruptcy ergo the burden will remain on you and your name (though apparently there is something in the works to change this).

In all the muck there is one glimmer of truth though, which is that the Chinese invest in property disproportionately - although the 70 percent homeownership bull is obviously yet another fake CCP statistic. Some more Xi-onomics: due to Xi's housing overturn few years ago Chinese real estate has been losing value at a steady pace and many leasers would now have to take a 20-35 percent loss if they'd choose get rid of the asset. Gold is the Chinese's only investment option left, everything else is losing value (housing market) , stagnant (Chinese stock market), heavily restricted (forex, foreign stock markets), or prohibited (bitcoin).

The 70% home ownership rate in China is for Chinese millennials. The rate is much higher for the general population, over 90%. That stat above which you are disputing is from the BBC, hardly a pro-China source, an outlet that will bend over backwards to present China in the worst possible light.

 

[Cooper]

The Chinese didn't invent technologies like high-speed rail, thorium-powered nuclear plants, solar panels etc, but they are good at taking STEALING these foreign techs, improving them and implementing them on a massive scale.

China stipulated technology transfers with companies like Siemens, Tesla, Apple in exchange for access to their domestic market, so not exactly theft. We should do the same to them in technologies where they are now more advanced, like EVs, batteries and solar panels and force China to transfer tech in order to sell locally produced EVs.

I've talked before about China reviving suppressed western tech, here is a very good example:



"This is a genuinely incredible story: China found in U.S. archives an energy source that could power its entire future for 20,000 years - and they just made it work.

I'm not exaggerating. In the 1960s the U.S. - specifically Oak Ridge National Laboratory in Tennessee - invented a revolutionary type of nuclear reactor that could run on thorium instead of uranium (much more abundant and cheaper), with no meltdown risk, generating 50x less waste, and requiring no water. Then, due to messy politics, they killed the program in 1969 and fired the visionary behind it.

Afterwards the declassified blueprints for the project sat forgotten in archives for decades. That is until Chinese scientists found them and decided in 2011 to run an experimental project in the Gansu desert to see if they could make it work.A few days ago, after 14 years of work, they finally did.

I spent many days researching this and wrote the full story - how the technology works, the bureaucratic politics that killed it in America, and why this could genuinely be game-changing."

 

[magoo]

Nothing official that comes from China is worth anything. No statistic no data. It´s all fabricated. It might coincide with the truth sometimes other times not.

Chinese work. They work 365/24h. They are focused. And have a cunning but at the same time no bullshit mentality.

At this moment real estate is in deep shit and therefore all economy. The elite doesn´t like Xijiping. And misses the age before him. Because he is wrecking the economy. This transfer from real estate to tech investment is bullshit. Chinese real estate is just unsustainable anymore.

Property rights are respected during the lease period. More than in the west. During that period it´s better to be a chinese owner than a westerner.

But of course because it´s a communist shithole the land is owned by government. Like all red shit holes. Even though to be fair London is the same. With lords owning the land through leaseholds.

I rather pay property taxes and live in the western model than the chinese regarding property however.

 

[Read_Lives_of_Saints]

To my knowledge, there is no inheritance tax in China, so your progeny will inherit your property tax-free, not the case in many western countries, and even where you can inherit property tax-free, you still have to go through expensive notary and estate planning services. I doubt that in 22nd century China the second or third generation would be evicted or repossessed once those theoretical leases expire, China being a nation of homeowners.

I would much, much rather have that Chinese system, than have to pay around 1.25% annual tax on the values of my properties. Paying that percentage, that rises every few years with each reassessment, over a period of 99 years is equivalent to losing a big chunk of your property, given the power of compound interest.

As well property taxes result in millions of older retirees being forced out of their homes and having to relocate to cheaper areas because they can't afford to pay these taxes every year.

Speculative whataboutism from someone who doesn't know the Chinese housing system.

Why don't you invest in some Chinese real estate if it's so great? Oh yeah, it's extremely difficult for foreigners to lease property there, and even if you did, you would be a prime target for it being taken off of you since you're not Chinese.

I heard a few times about people, usually foreigners, losing badly when trying to buy commercial properties. The scam was always sub-leasing where the current tenant claimed to be the "owner" (actually the lessee) and all their papers said so, but after the deal was completed it turned out the the real owner was the PLA (military), so the "buyer" had no recourse whatsoever.

I knew two foreign bar/restaurant owners this happened to, one in Guangzhou and one in Beijing. Sorry mate, your 300K元 just disappeared.

And those numbers on home ownership at 70-90% are nonsense. As I said before, in all my years there I only knew one young person who bought his own condo in the Guangzhou metro area. Everyone else was living with family or renting. Chinese movies and TV don't even try to show 70% home ownership.

 

[Read_Lives_of_Saints]

I've talked before about China reviving suppressed western tech, here is a very good example:

"This is a genuinely incredible story: China found in U.S. archives an energy source that could power its entire future for 20,000 years - and they just made it work."

Big if true. Would be funny if it turned out the Chinese were monitoring Alex Jones for these lost tech opportunities, researching his conspiracy theories and then capitalizing

 

[Cooper]

Speculative whataboutism from someone who doesn't know the Chinese housing system.

Why don't you invest in some Chinese real estate if it's so great? Oh yeah, it's extremely difficult for foreigners to lease property there, and even if you did, you would be a prime target for it being taken off of you since you're not Chinese.

I heard a few times about people, usually foreigners, losing badly when trying to buy commercial properties. The scam was always sub-leasing where the current tenant claimed to be the "owner" (actually the lessee) and all their papers said so, but after the deal was completed it turned out the the real owner was the PLA (military), so the "buyer" had no recourse whatsoever.

I knew two foreign bar/restaurant owners this happened to, one in Guangzhou and one in Beijing. Sorry mate, your 300K元 just disappeared.

And those numbers on home ownership at 70-90% are nonsense. As I said before, in all my years there I only knew one young person who bought his own condo in the Guangzhou metro area. Everyone else was living with family or renting. Chinese movies and TV don't even try to show 70% home ownership.

You never buy real estate in places where you don't live, or at the very least, do not intend to visit and vacation regularly, unless you have a very good local that you trust, but even then it's not an ideal investment situation.

This being said, the China haters need to get your their housing story straight, you can't have these two statements be simultaneously true:

- Over 90% home ownership numbers are fake
- There are millions upon millions of empty apartments in China.

So I'll go with the HSBC and BBC numbers here instead of relying on the feelings of a 老外 who lived there 10 years ago and who seems to have had a very bitter experience there, no offense.

Big if true. Would be funny if it turned out the Chinese were monitoring Alex Jones for these lost tech opportunities, researching his conspiracy theories and then capitalizing

Other examples of neglected western tech that led to breakthroughs is the technology behind hypersonic missiles and supercavitating torpedoes that travel underwater at 200km/h. Those technologies were built on French physicist Jean-Pierre Petit's research on magnetohydrodynamics (MHD) in the 1980s. He was considered and eccentric kook in his home country, but the Russians, who had a passion and deep understanding of theoretical maths, picked it up and run with it, followed by the Chinese.

 

[NSOE]

Can't help noticing 'Embracing Net Zero Future' on the hull of the thorium powered vessel, stupid slogans may be just for show but they're on display.

 

[Read_Lives_of_Saints]

This being said, the China haters need to get your their housing story straight, you can't have these two statements be simultaneously true:

- Over 90% home ownership numbers are fake
- There are millions upon millions of empty apartments in China.

What do you think is incongruent about both of those being simultaneously true?

The second point contributes to the misleading or fake statistic of the first point.

Ever since laws limiting the number of "houses" per household being tax exempt, Chinese have found ways to own multiples, including getting divorced on paper in order to reap tax benefits or so that the wife can have one in her name as an investment.

Beijing moves to end practice of faking divorce to buy additional home

Anyone with a Beijing hukou who is divorced but owned two properties while they were married cannot buy another home in Beijing for three years, according to a notice issued by the Beijing Municipal Commission of Housing and Urban-rural Development.

www.scmp.com

China Home Sales Skirt Policies With Fake Divorces, Attics
By Bloomberg News
August 15, 2011 at 10:25 PM CDT

Couples fake divorce to buy property

The latest government regulation limiting families to the purchase of only one new apartment has led many couples in the city to fake a divorce to dodge the rule.

www.chinadaily.com.cn

 

[Australia Sucks]

And those numbers on home ownership at 70-90% are nonsense. As I said before, in all my years there I only knew one young person who bought his own condo in the Guangzhou metro area. Everyone else was living with family or renting. Chinese movies and TV don't even try to show 70% home ownership.

I have mentioned this before that there are a huge number of Chinese from rural abandoned villages that own abandoned worthless property in their dying home village while they are living in a major city working in a factory and paying rent to live in an overcrowded shared apartment. On paper they are a homeowner but it’s a very meaningless form of home ownership. There are likely a few hundred million people in this type of situation. While this is going on there are tens of millions of empty apartment buildings that Chinese people cannot afford to buy and were built during the speculative property boom that are just slowly rotting away not even being rented because even the rent is too unaffordable for people.

 

[Australia Sucks]

- Over 90% home ownership numbers are fake
- There are millions upon millions of empty apartments in China.

That is exactly how communism works because there aren’t true price signals driving the process so you get this seemingly contradictory outcome.

So you can have millions of empty apartments built that are unaffordable (luxury) for the majority of Chinese (built as a store of value for wealthy speculators during the Chinese property boom which is now dead) or built in ghost cities where there are no jobs so nobody wants to live there meanwhile there are a huge percentage of people who cannot afford to buy a property.

China didn’t build affordable property in locations where people actually want to live. The properties were either in poor locations or too unaffordable for the Chinese population to buy. A classic misallocation of capital that occurs in a communist system.