Martial Arts/MMA Thread

[magoo]

We don't have BJJ for 3 year olds around here.

What do you guys recommend for a 3 year old?

Nothing. Let him sleep and fart peacefully. The most important sport for toddlers is swimming anyway. For obvious reasons. You don’t want him to drown in a friends pool. It’s also good for preventing colds.

Real martial arts should be taught after they become 12. Bone structure, memory etc. I think even BJJ only starts really counting for belts after 16 year old. But I could be wrong.

If you want him to do self defense in school just teach him how to throw an elbow strike. Believe me it’s more than enough and nobody will mess with him. The schools staff might not enjoy it much.

Until they’re 12 years old I only do some light lessons with my kids. Mostly defense.

The front kick is really a good way to defend without hurting the other person much.

 

[Papist]

I have trained in karate (5 yrs), boxing (2 yrs) and JKD (1 yr).

I have huge respect for Bruce Lee and think he was correct when he said:




Each martial art style seems to have weaknesses. Even one of the most well regarded, Muay Thai, has a weakness IMHO, in its stance.

My belief is that boxing is too limited, karate has far too many techniques and includes blocks that are ineffective. There's no standardised JKD system, and I also thought one often over committed in some of the attacks. What I am planning to do is practice a small number of techniques daily:

Strikes:
- jab
- cross
- hook
- finger strike

Kicks:
- front kick (Mae Geri)
- roundhouse (Mawashi Geri)
- stomping kick (Fumikomi)
- side kick (Yoko Geri)


What I do not have are any blocking techniques. In JKD there was a very simple one that was employed, which I might practice. The bobbing and weaving from boxing is also effective once mastered. For some reason I always found it very difficult!

When I've regained my fitness, I might attend a boxing class. I would like to do judo, but I think I'm too old as it's very tough on one's joints.

I wish there was an online syllabus I could find, but a search elicited nothing.

Anything to add? Any (constructive, hopefully) criticism?

I think with the way society's going, it's good to be able to defend oneself, and protect the vulnerable, if need be. Plus it's good exercise.

 

[MacManus]

Nothing. Let him sleep and fart peacefully. The most important sport for toddlers is swimming anyway. For obvious reasons. You don’t want him to drown in a friends pool. It’s also good for preventing colds.

Real martial arts should be taught after they become 12. Bone structure, memory etc. I think even BJJ only starts really counting for belts after 16 year old. But I could be wrong.

If you want him to do self defense in school just teach him how to throw an elbow strike. Believe me it’s more than enough and nobody will mess with him. The schools staff might not enjoy it much.

Until they’re 12 years old I only do some light lessons with my kids. Mostly defense.

The front kick is really a good way to defend without hurting the other person much.

IMO you don't need to wait to 12 but agree that 3 is too young. Focus on swimming (or at this point realistically just getting comfortable in the water) as you said, as well as gymnastics for general motor skill development. BJJ or wrestling can start at 5-6.

 

[MacManus]

I have trained in karate (5 yrs), boxing (2 yrs) and JKD (1 yr).

I have huge respect for Bruce Lee and think he was correct when he said:

View attachment 3586


Each martial art style seems to have weaknesses. Even one of the most well regarded, Muay Thai, has a weakness IMHO, in its stance.

My belief is that boxing is too limited, karate has far too many techniques and includes blocks that are ineffective. There's no standardised JKD system, and I also thought one often over committed in some of the attacks. What I am planning to do is practice a small number of techniques daily:

Strikes:
- jab
- cross
- hook
- finger strike

Kicks:
- front kick (Mae Geri)
- roundhouse (Mawashi Geri)
- stomping kick (Fumikomi)
- side kick (Yoko Geri)


What I do not have are any blocking techniques. In JKD there was a very simple one that was employed, which I might practice. The bobbing and weaving from boxing is also effective once mastered. For some reason I always found it very difficult!

When I've regained my fitness, I might attend a boxing class. I would like to do judo, but I think I'm too old as it's very tough on one's joints.

I wish there was an online syllabus I could find, but a search elicited nothing.

Anything to add? Any (constructive, hopefully) criticism?

I think with the way society's going, it's good to be able to defend oneself, and protect the vulnerable, if need be. Plus it's good exercise.

If your goal is self defense you need a) something with live sparring for pressure testing and b) at least some capability in both striking and grappling (fine to primarily focus on one or the other, but you need at least a basic level of competence in both). Given that it seems you already have some striking experience I'd give BJJ a try (try to look for a school that regularly starts rolls from the feet, so you'll get a little bit of judo/wrestling work in as well), and maybe mix in the occasional striking class to keep sharp.

I wouldn't wait to "get back in shape" before joining a martial arts gym, that's a recipe for putting it off for years (ask me how I know!)...the BJJ classes or whatever you sign up for will get you in shape, and you can supplement with lifting or outside cardio as needed.

 

[magoo]

IMO you don't need to wait to 12 but agree that 3 is too young. Focus on swimming (or at this point realistically just getting comfortable in the water) as you said, as well as gymnastics for general motor skill development. BJJ or wrestling can start at 5-6.

It will be mostly a gymnastic class. My kids after 6 years went to both karate (one year), BJJ (one class during their vacations) and MT (one class during vacations). The logistics involved with more one equipment to wash and iron. It was a waste of time and money. They play rugby, swimming, music lessons, soccer etc. But it’s not mandatory. Besides tournaments. If they don’t feel like training they don’t go. Except swimming. Which is one time per week.

My oldest when he was 6 year old we enrolled him in a lot of things. He would enter the car and start sleeping. Always tired. That´s not the way to do it. There needs to be a balance. They are kids. Let them play videogames and just hang around doing nothing.

TMA instills some discipline. But I wouldn´t recommend before 12. To each his own. This year the 12 year old in September will start Hapkido for real (if his class schedule allows) since I want him to learn joint manipulations so whenever possible he doesn´t have to use striking. And will probably change from rugby to rowing. Sub 14 rugby becomes too risky. Not the games but training. Some idiot kids will go to training days just to hurt others.

In 3 years the when 15years the oldest will start with MT in a nice area school. And will do 1-2 years of BJJ or Judo.

Rugby until they´re sub 8 they don´t tackle. Only play with tags because of the bone structure. They also don´t have maturity to understand consequences.

 

[magoo]

If your goal is self defense you need a) something with live sparring for pressure testing and b) at least some capability in both striking and grappling (fine to primarily focus on one or the other, but you need at least a basic level of competence in both). Given that it seems you already have some striking experience I'd give BJJ a try (try to look for a school that regularly starts rolls from the feet, so you'll get a little bit of judo/wrestling work in as well), and maybe mix in the occasional striking class to keep sharp.

I wouldn't wait to "get back in shape" before joining a martial arts gym, that's a recipe for putting it off for years (ask me how I know!)...the BJJ classes or whatever you sign up for will get you in shape, and you can supplement with lifting or outside cardio as needed.

Without live sparring it´s just a coreographed dance.

Bruce Lee said something like one year of boxe and wrestling will beat a lifelong martial artist.

 

[PurpleUrkel]

Whenever I'm feeling a bit down I watch Diaz vs McGregor 1 and I instantly feel better.

 

[MacManus]

It will be mostly a gymnastic class. My kids after 6 years went to both karate (one year), BJJ (one class during their vacations) and MT (one class during vacations). The logistics involved with more one equipment to wash and iron. It was a waste of time and money. They play rugby, swimming, music lessons, soccer etc. But it’s not mandatory. Besides tournaments. If they don’t feel like training they don’t go. Except swimming. Which is one time per week.

My oldest when he was 6 year old we enrolled him in a lot of things. He would enter the car and start sleeping. Always tired. That´s not the way to do it. There needs to be a balance. They are kids. Let them play videogames and just hang around doing nothing.

TMA instills some discipline. But I wouldn´t recommend before 12. To each his own. This year the 12 year old in September will start Hapkido for real (if his class schedule allows) since I want him to learn joint manipulations so whenever possible he doesn´t have to use striking. And will probably change from rugby to rowing. Sub 14 rugby becomes too risky. Not the games but training. Some idiot kids will go to training days just to hurt others.

In 3 years the when 15years the oldest will start with MT in a nice area school. And will do 1-2 years of BJJ or Judo.

Rugby until they´re sub 8 they don´t tackle. Only play with tags because of the bone structure. They also don´t have maturity to understand consequences.

Yeah overcommitment/overtraining is definitely a risk. Swimming and some form of martial art (or gymnastics when very young) 1x/week each is probably good...if they want to do more there's always that option. Formal swimming classes also aren't really necessary once they reach the point where they can be in water over their heads for 5-10 minutes without drowning as well.

Team sports are great too but I like the idea of introducing them later in life and when the child is aware enough to choose what they want to play...don't think throwing 4 year olds on a soccer field for an hour twice a week really accomplishes much.

Other factor is that homeschooling for those who are able (and I'm not judging, we're sending ours to Catholic school which solves the biggest problems with public schooling but not all of them) frees up a lot of time as you can get a full public school day's worth of academic work accomplished in 2-3 hours.

 

[MacManus]

Without live sparring it´s just a coreographed dance.

Bruce Lee said something like one year of boxe and wrestling will beat a lifelong martial artist.

Funny thing about TMAs is that while they are largely useless (for training to fight--not disparaging that they have other benefits such as fitness, mental discipline etc) they do have techniques that can be adapted into more practical fighting styles once you have a base....I trained and competed some in TKD as a kid/teenager, mostly train BJJ now but do a kickboxing sparring class about once a week...I'm a decently big dude, about 6'/215 and people do not expect me to be able to hit them with a crescent kick especially after using multiple teeps to set it up

 

[Wutang]

Without live sparring it´s just a coreographed dance.

Bruce Lee said something like one year of boxe and wrestling will beat a lifelong martial artist.

A big reason for the dominance of wresting in MMA isn't just because of the techniques (though of course having a good double and single leg is a big leg up) but because of the way wrestlers trains. There's no such thing as a casual or hobbyist wrestler. If you are on the wrestling team then you are expected to compete and all of your training will be geared towards that. That means endless hours of grueling conditioning, drilling and going live. This really builds a level of physical prowess as well as mental toughness that you just aren't going to get from doing karate 3 hours a week at some strip mall.

A common thing you would see back in older MMA fights once wrestlers started pouring in to the sport is seeing some wrestler who only had a bit of basic submission skills take down some BJJ black belt guy and and grind him down and win either by decision or by a ground and pound TKO. The BJJ guy would have technique but the wrestler would be able to be able to take down the BJJ guy or at least push him against the cage and just drain his stamina and since the wrestler would usually be better conditioned and would just be more used to these grueling situations they would just win just based on toughness rather then being technically superior.

 

[Get2choppaaa]

A big reason for the dominance of wresting in MMA isn't just because of the techniques (though of course having a good double and single leg is a big leg up) but because of the way wrestlers trains. There's no such thing as a casual or hobbyist wrestler. If you are on the wrestling team then you are expected to compete and all of your training will be geared towards that. That means endless hours of grueling conditioning, drilling and going live. This really builds a level of physical prowess as well as mental toughness that you just aren't going to get from doing karate 3 hours a week at some strip mall.

A common thing you would see back in older MMA fights once wrestlers started pouring in to the sport is seeing some wrestler who only had a bit of basic submission skills take down some BJJ black belt guy and and grind him down and win either by decision or by a ground and pound TKO. The BJJ guy would have technique but the wrestler would be able to be able to take down the BJJ guy or at least push him against the cage and just drain his stamina and since the wrestler would usually be better conditioned and would just be more used to these grueling situations they would just win just based on toughness rather then being technically superior.

Mental toughness ...

Dudes like Dan Sevren, Don Frye, Mark Coleman (even Ken Shamrock) pretty much wrecked early UFC and Pride.

All wrestling background.

 

[budoslavic]

We don't have BJJ for 3 year olds around here.

What do you guys recommend for a 3 year old?

As someone who was a full time karate instructor (2+ years) back in early 2000's, typically most martial art schools tend to teach discipline, respect, focus, exercises, martial art terminologies, basic techniques, etc. to small children (3 to 6 years old) for 30 minutes -- twice a week plus Saturdays sometime.

Based on my teaching experience, I noticed small children have short attention span and they get bored easily, but they do absorb information and learn quickly -- it really depends on how good the instructor is with children.

A lot of children tends to drop out quickly between six months to a year due to boredom, lack of interest or busy with other activities (i.e., sports, ballet, music, etc.).

It is pretty easy to spot a child's passion and motivation in martial arts classes. And it is also quite easy to see which child will quit or drop out.

If you have any questions, feel free to PM me.

Note: My martial arts background is traditional Japanese karate & kobudo (32 years). I had also cross trained in other martial art styles (Korean, Okinawan, etc.) while training in my current style.

 

[jaguarcat]

So, which one is the best for street fighting? I say MMA as it got both striking and ground skills, then boxing or muay thai. (don't see BJJ being that good against a boxer in the street, unless one manages to take him down to the ground, but I say a good boxer will likely knock bjj fighter out in the process)

 

[Get2choppaaa]

So, which one is the best for street fighting? I say MMA as it got both striking and ground skills, then boxing or muay thai. (don't see BJJ being that good against a boxer in the street, unless one manages to take him down to the ground, but I say a good boxer will likely knock bjj fighter out in the process)

you just need to learn from BAS



"Dang-e-da, Dang-e-da, Dang!" .... "Everyone understimates a kick in the groin."

 

[jaguarcat]

you just need to learn from BAS



"Dang-e-da, Dang-e-da, Dang!" .... "Everyone understimates a kick in the groin."

That's a lot of muay thai right there

 

[TruthTeller]

So, which one is the best for street fighting? I say MMA as it got both striking and ground skills, then boxing or muay thai. (don't see BJJ being that good against a boxer in the street, unless one manages to take him down to the ground, but I say a good boxer will likely knock bjj fighter out in the process)

My answer is none and to avoid at all costs, but a mix of one striking and one grappling would be good for unavoidable situations. To your last sentence, no 9/10 times the wrestler / BJJ fighter / grappler would take down the boxer before getting hit, whether you want to go to the ground is another story/question all together.

 

[jaguarcat]

My answer is none and to avoid at all costs, but a mix of one striking and one grappling would be good for unavoidable situations. To your last sentence, no 9/10 times the wrestler or grappler would take down the boxer before getting hit, whether you want to go to the ground is another story/question all together.

Well the boxer/thai boxer obviously does not want to ever go to the ground, so the goal is to knock the opponent out or maintain the distance otherwise.
Any proof that bjj would win over a boxer in 9 out if 10 cases, or ever? On MMA forums the consensus seems to be in favor of boxers.
One thing is boxers are definitely faster than bjj folks, they train for speed and usually got genetics for this

 

[TruthTeller]

A big reason for the dominance of wresting in MMA isn't just because of the techniques (though of course having a good double and single leg is a big leg up) but because of the way wrestlers trains. There's no such thing as a casual or hobbyist wrestler. If you are on the wrestling team then you are expected to compete and all of your training will be geared towards that. That means endless hours of grueling conditioning, drilling and going live. This really builds a level of physical prowess as well as mental toughness that you just aren't going to get from doing karate 3 hours a week at some strip mall.

A common thing you would see back in older MMA fights once wrestlers started pouring in to the sport is seeing some wrestler who only had a bit of basic submission skills take down some BJJ black belt guy and and grind him down and win either by decision or by a ground and pound TKO. The BJJ guy would have technique but the wrestler would be able to be able to take down the BJJ guy or at least push him against the cage and just drain his stamina and since the wrestler would usually be better conditioned and would just be more used to these grueling situations they would just win just based on toughness rather then being technically superior.

The wrestlers weak point in the early days was not knowing submissions or sub defense. Once they overcome that gap, they are beasts.

 

[Wutang]

The wrestlers weak point in the early days was not knowing submissions or sub defense. Once they overcome that gap, they are beasts.

And these wrestlers don't even have to really master submission a black belt level. Once they have the foundations combined with their physical and mental attributes it's enough for them to beat a lot of submission specialists in a MMA fight.

 

[jaguarcat]

I think the dominance of wrestling in MMA is the show factor, honestly, for many it's more fun to watch = money maker