I almost entirely agree however perhaps there is something more to contemplate on this subject.
female sentiment on the forum regarding gays and lesbians
- Thread starter stadtaffe
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"Do what you can and God will take care of what you cannot do." This is something all of us Christians need to remember when we are struggling with our sins, whatever they may be. It also calls us to self-reflect: "Am I really doing all that I can do?" That was a very moving video. Thank you for sharing it.
The problem is that the supply of "gay" children doesn't meet the demand of single liberal women. And thus, the childhood "trans" epidemic is created.
I'm interested in your responses to this thread.
In the last weeks I did have one thought, a small insight into it which has probably been said elsewhere.
With the attack on the nuclear family, demotion of the man as head of it and his replacement with the government and the woman, and a general atomisation, there is demand, as you put it for companionship for women to fill up the void - enter the small dogs and the poofs.
Actually re single liberal women, I couldn't believe when I heard that their vote for Kamala is significant just because they care so much about abortion.
I just wanted to hear from women who had some level of aversion to the poofs.
My ex did not, and as mentioned in another thread I had to enact measures to make sure we were away from the poofs once we had a child, as she really was blind to there being any issue or threat with them.
I could probably fill up a thousand words or more about why I feel so strongly negative towards poofs, although it is of a personal nature to put it all on a public forum, relating to various experiences from my childhood through to adulthood, and the biblical teachings only strengthen what I naturally feel anyway.
But as mentioned in my other thread, on my 3rd date with this women a lot younger than me and actually fitting all my rarefied criteria, she let it drop that she was attending a gay wedding, she's good friends with one of the grooms. Anyway, my heart dropped I just thought "oh no not again".. All the positive traits she had unfortunately had a dark shadow cast over them from that point on.
But it's what I said above - an aspect of single liberal woman is often devotion to a career in the same way that a man is. Then once she has created a void and unbalance in her life but delaying children etc, the poofs can help fill that void unfortunately. Maybe they like to discuss the men they are into with a man who is into other men.
Something that needs to be pointed out is that there is an over-representation of gay men working in the industries of fashion and hair, at lower and upper hierarchies.
If you go into a hairdressing salon, anyone working there who is not a woman is probably 60% likely to be a gay man.
What I would be very curious to know is - in say 1940 or 1950, is that what a hair salon was like - were there poofs in the industry even back then?
I am guessing somehow not, it was probably women for women-only hair salons and men only for mens barbershops, but no poofters. Not through law, just through tradition and culture. Just a theory, that that has evolved in parallel.
If you go into a hairdressing salon, anyone working there who is not a woman is probably 60% likely to be a gay man.
What I would be very curious to know is - in say 1940 or 1950, is that what a hair salon was like - were there poofs in the industry even back then?
I am guessing somehow not, it was probably women for women-only hair salons and men only for mens barbershops, but no poofters. Not through law, just through tradition and culture. Just a theory, that that has evolved in parallel.
I believe in most of America, it was like you said. Barbers in barber shops, and women stylists in women's hair salons.
However, I believe even in the 40's or 50's, upscale beauty salons in fashionable areas like New York, Paris, and Hollywood/Beverly Hills would have had a noticeable presence of gay hair stylists.
I actually knew this super liberal girl whose mother is a typical Gen X liberal Karen that complains about Trump constantly and this woman actually said once that she wish she could have had a gay son in addition to the three daughters she already has. It wasn't merely just "Oh I would still love and support my child if he was gay" but that she actively wanted a potential son to be a homosexual. I wonder if this another version of a woman wanting to have a fag hag/gay familiar as a pet but only instead of having this gay pet being a male friend it would be her own son.
A striking thing was how this woman expressed her desire for a gay son pretty openly. If this woman had instead said that she would hope that her kids would be straight then it would have let to some big fallouts in her social life and who maybe an online lynch mob forming if the comment somehow spread on social media.
I have no issues with gays and lesbians as long as they keep to themselves. My concern is with those who are overtly flamboyant, constantly proclaiming their sexuality and forcing others to accept them, or engaging in inappropriate behavior.
However, I appreciate gays and lesbians who channel their identity into positive pursuits like fashion design or hairstyling. Many have also developed a great sense of humor.
This video tells the story of a Christian preacher who goes to the Tel Aviv gay pride parade. But at the 1:12 mark, a gay man starts twerking. I find it absolutely amusing.
However, I appreciate gays and lesbians who channel their identity into positive pursuits like fashion design or hairstyling. Many have also developed a great sense of humor.
This video tells the story of a Christian preacher who goes to the Tel Aviv gay pride parade. But at the 1:12 mark, a gay man starts twerking. I find it absolutely amusing.
Vidal Sassoon, a hairstylist icon with an "early life..." His iconic hair cut:
As my priest said when me and my wife were converting..."sex in marriage is blessed, but if you're reenacting something you saw on the Internet.... That's a problem"
Butt sex is in no way a remotely natural component of married life. I can see arguments for oral sex as a different category, but none the less... These are not topics for the Internet.
You don't think butt sex has any place in a marriage? I will play the devil's advocate here.
For example what if there is a married couple and they are not yet ready to have children?
A lot of men do not like using condoms and other forms of contraceptives have side effects or aren't fully effective so anal sex can be a way to circumvent these issues. If it is between a man and a woman is it really that big of a deal?
It's disgusting, what's wrong with you!
The assumption here is that sex is for pleasure. From the Christian perspective it isn't. It is pleasurable, just like eating can be pleasurable, but if you are doing it just for pleasure then something is off base. This is entirely why homosexuality is sinful because just like gluttony detaches food from it's purpose and makes it about pleasure, homosexuality totally removes sex from its intended purpose and makes it only a sterile act of hedonism, and a society that embraces that writ-large is doomed to downfall because it is way off from it's intended purpose.
So any act of sodomy (sodomy includes oral sex) is sinful because it is trying to make sex all about the pleasure without the consequences. Our society is rotting precisely because of doing this.
I asked this before on the previous page and the person who I was asking didn't want to engage so I will ask you instead. Does this apply to kissing or any other act of foreplay or part of lovemaking that typically precedes full consumption of the sex act but by itself wouldn't lead to pregnancy? If kissing your spouse is okay but preforming oral sex isn't then what is the difference is other than the mouth is being used on a different body part?
To use the food analogy - does this mean eating dessert would be prohibited or at least frowned upon under Orthodox ethics? Dessert is a dish that is all about the taste and not so much about the nutritional value or nourishment. People typically eat it AFTER they have already been satiated from a full meal so the purpose of eating dessert isn't for satisfying hunger.
EDIT: I saw someone actually did have a response to my question before but I'm hoping that you can put more detail into "things having their proper place". I'm not really sure why love making between a heterosexual married couple would be improperly placed. Homosexual sex is completely sterile and cut off from any possibility of producing life so I can understand why that would be seen as a complete misuse of sex but I don't understand how this carries over to heterosexual sex even when the married couples doesn't go into the act thinking they are actively looking to produce children.
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I read over Fr. Trenham's article on lawful sexual practices that was posted earlier (http://orthodoxinfo.com/praxis/frjosiah_sexualrelations.aspx). I found myself agreeing with most of it and especially the part about how the modern world is in error when it teaches that "Sex is absolutely vital to full human development and happiness." I think this is false even when it comes from a secular perspective and I think a big reason why you have communities of incels that gather online for the sole purpose of discussing not being able to get sex is because the modern world teaches that pushes the idea that sex is a required for a fulfilling life and that you are somehow lacking if you aren't able to acquire it. It's the same thing that companies do in advertising where they acquire potential customers by creating a feeling in these people that they are lacking something that only the product being sold can fix.
I also agree with him that "God has designed sexual relations for three basic reasons: to avoid fornication, to unite the husband and wife as a powerful adhesive, and to bring forth children to be raised to worship God and for the upbuilding of the Church" He later on goes on to write that oral and anal sex is prohibited but I don't see how this follows from what he wrote earlier on the purpose of sex. If the only purpose of sex was to create children then it would make logical sense but according to him, sex also has the purpose of bonding husband and wife.
He also writes against contraception but what differs contraception from sex acts that don't directly lead to impregnations is that the explicit use of contraception is to prevent children from being created (when it works) while having oral or other sex acts doesn't mean you are cutting off the potential to create life. That is why I don't think these two things can be grouped together.
I also agree with him that "God has designed sexual relations for three basic reasons: to avoid fornication, to unite the husband and wife as a powerful adhesive, and to bring forth children to be raised to worship God and for the upbuilding of the Church" He later on goes on to write that oral and anal sex is prohibited but I don't see how this follows from what he wrote earlier on the purpose of sex. If the only purpose of sex was to create children then it would make logical sense but according to him, sex also has the purpose of bonding husband and wife.
He also writes against contraception but what differs contraception from sex acts that don't directly lead to impregnations is that the explicit use of contraception is to prevent children from being created (when it works) while having oral or other sex acts doesn't mean you are cutting off the potential to create life. That is why I don't think these two things can be grouped together.
Kissing is not inherently sexual. Christians traditionally greet one another with a kiss, that doesn't mean anything sexual whatsoever. I presume you are referring to passionate kissing, in which case I would say that the distinction would be that no sexual body parts are involve in a kiss but in oral sex there are, so that it is a pretty big difference.
The most ascetical Orthodox people probably wouldn't eat dessert, just like they would be completely celibate. This is the ideal standard but not everyone meets it. Fasting within the context of the Orthodox church actually addresses these kinds of things. If you're making desserts every day during the fast and expressly looking to eat foods that are pleasurable you're not quite fasting properly, even if you meet the dietary restrictions. Married couples also are expected to refrain from sex during these periods. Do people fail? Yes. But this doesn't change the standards strived for. Do married couples have sex just for pleasure? Yes. If they are a communing member of the Orthodox church they should confess it, and if someone eats desserts because they taste good they should confess that. The standards set in Orthodoxy are high, we don't lower them because they are hard, we lower ourselves to a place of humility and we confess our weakness.
Sex is procreative. It doesn't always lead to conception. But if you are actively trying to make it not lead to conception but still get the pleasure from it then it is off-base. A married couple aren't going to conceive a child every time they make love, but if they are making love they ought to be fully aware of the purpose behind what they are doing, and be open to having children. Otherwise one might ask why they even got married
Wouldn't passionate kissing as in the type of kissing a couple would engage in as foreplay still count as doing something sexually related for the purpose of pleasure rater than procreation? Based on the other posts I was reading here, the main concern from the Orthodox side is whether a sexual act directly leads to the producing of a new life and whether it's purely for pleasure. Kissing of any sort no matter what body part is being kissed would not to lead impregnation so according to this standard, it seems like you would have to say kissing is off the table as well.
Having oral sex or engaging in passionate kissing wouldn't mean you are preventing conception from taking place, unlike with the use of contraception. A couple could engage in these sort of sex acts AND still have the end of result of their lovemaking be conception. This isn't the case with the use of contraception so I wouldn't group these two things in the same category.
I feel like this is off topic really. I'm alsp not really that invested in, or qualified enough to address all your issues with the Orthodox position on this matter. So I'm gonna leave it here. Have a good one
Regarding sex within marriage, I do see in the scriptures that sex in not only for having children its also for pleasure and to prevent people from living a sinful lifestyle, for example, you get apostle Paul telling people if they are burning with passion its best they get married, he also talks about how during sex the couples should be trying to serve each other instead of themselves, when a period a prayer and fasting is over apostle Paul encourages married couples to have sex again so satan doesnt tempt them, Jesus in the gospels said its a sin to lust against a woman who you are not married to, but what about your wife? Have you guys ever read the song of solomon, king Solomon is basically bragging about the beauty and sexual body parts of his wife, her breasts are mentioned in the scriptures.
Im not a priest, a monk or an expert on this topic, Im a married layman so I might be wrong but I do have lust but I lust towards my wife and sometimes quite a lot, I too like king Solomon make comments to my wife about her body and we have a lot of fun when we have sex, for the privacy of what goes on in my marriage bed I wont mention what we do and also to keep this forum clean but many times when we are intimate its all just passion and lust for each other, I also obviously love her and show her love too but I attack her like a wild man many times and rip her clothes off in a non gentle way, etc (censored).
The idea that sex within marriage is ONLY to produce a baby I dont think thats accurate, what if your wife is baron or after menopause, is a husband not suppose to touch his wife anymore? I remember reading the story of Abraham when he went down to Egypt with his baron wife and he lied to pharoah and said it was his sister, but pharoah saw Abraham "sporting" her through the window and realized it was his wife.
Im not a priest, a monk or an expert on this topic, Im a married layman so I might be wrong but I do have lust but I lust towards my wife and sometimes quite a lot, I too like king Solomon make comments to my wife about her body and we have a lot of fun when we have sex, for the privacy of what goes on in my marriage bed I wont mention what we do and also to keep this forum clean but many times when we are intimate its all just passion and lust for each other, I also obviously love her and show her love too but I attack her like a wild man many times and rip her clothes off in a non gentle way, etc (censored).
The idea that sex within marriage is ONLY to produce a baby I dont think thats accurate, what if your wife is baron or after menopause, is a husband not suppose to touch his wife anymore? I remember reading the story of Abraham when he went down to Egypt with his baron wife and he lied to pharoah and said it was his sister, but pharoah saw Abraham "sporting" her through the window and realized it was his wife.
M.Balakirev
Protestant
It's amazing the number of men out there who think nothing of it. I think generally as women are the gatekeepers of sex, then they are the ones that also determine the barriers. I've tried to explain to men that anal is pure abuse of your spouse for your own pleasure as most women aren't into it, and certainly wouldn't dream of it unless the idea is placed there by the man. The whole thing is just degrading for both involved, not least the man because for him the woman's vagina isn't sufficient. As for kissing, I would have thought that that is a strong mix of passion and affection for your wife.....someone please correct me, but it seems more like dread than actual happiness being overly preoccupied with what you're allowed to do and not allowed to do.