Femininity in a woman and physical attractiveness

Wutang

Wutang

Protestant
Heirloom
On the one hand, we have Proverbs telling us about how charm and beauty is deceptive and fleeting.

But on the other hand, we still want is best for your progeny and that means looking at genetic fitness which physical beauty is usually correlated with.

A random video popped on my Youtube sidebar this morning and I was drawn by it from seeing the two girls featured on the preview image.



This got me a bit thinking because if you look at the girls, I wouldn't say they are knockouts but I still felt drawn just because of the way they presented themselves. They were looking feminine with their dresses and the way their hair and makeup were done which while it did accentuate their looks, it didn't do so in a overly sensual or conquettish manner like you would see with big IG influencer girls. They also had a nice smile as opposed to sticking their tongues out, trying to make "bedroom eyes" or otherwise having some overly loud and sensual facial expression.

It made me think a bit about if as men who are visual and do pay attention to a woman's appearance if we could cultivate our taste where instead of focusing on how "hot" a girl is we can instead learn to appreciate how she radiates feminine energy and just having class. I don't think it's realistic for guys to just not care about appearances at all but is it possible for us to refine our tastes to instead prefer something that is more healthy and would lead to us going after the right women?
 
Femininity is intriguing topic because I feel like its a lost art amongst young "modern women" ESPECIALLY in the west. I find myself at my age and place in life to be extremely attracted to what I perceive as femininity... which is somewhat hard to describe exactly what that is. I've been living in Panama for a few years up in the mountains. I took a three month hiatus to go live at the beach and surf and when I returned I went back to playing pickleball here. The first day I was back I noticed a youngish looking white girl (South African) who had a thick build (not thick like exaggerated t&a) she was just shy of being chubby.... though I did think she had nice legs and so did another older gent I play pickleball with. As far as her face she was very average but she had light eyes which I liked. It turns out she was 31 years old which to me is a dinosaur and something I wouldn't consider for any type of romantic relations. However she had what I would describe as a feminine way about her. Which I was incredibly attracted to. I couldn't even tell you exactly what it was. The way she would skip or hop up to the net while playing pickleball and her mannerisms just really struck me. I told a few of my friends about her and they were shocked I would have any interest in a 31 year old and quite frankly so was I. So I got her number and we went on a date and I asked her if she was vaccinated to which she replied yes. She didn't want to get it but she was in DC at the time going to college and it was mandated so she go it. That was that as my personal preference is that I would never date a girl with the vaccine. Shortly thereafter she moved back to South Africa. For me it was such a telling experience about "femininity."

On the same topic here is a post I made on the RVF about the same topic:

A few years ago when I was back living in America it was national garden and this lovely old plantation on the bay turned into a venue for weddings, photo shoots, ect had free admission. It was a lovely sunny 75* day so I decided to go check it out. I stayed there for around 4 hours just soaking up the sun an the beauty of the place...however I started noticing somethings as I was hanging out and people watching. What I noticed was how obnoxious and masculine the young women around me were... it became surreal, I was in this beautiful sunny setting but these repulsive girls around me were loud and bitching about co workers and complaining about the stupidest things. The one example that stood out the most was a young thin girl with a boy haircut and her ass cheeks hanging out of her cut off shorts... belittling her dad. I was walking behind them an she said something about her friend was getting married in India or Thailand an he said oh cool maybe there will be a elephant in the wedding, an she starts blasting him cause which ever country he said it was the other one that does weddings with elephants apparently and she was calling him racist and being so rude.. he looked defeated an upset and tried to say he was just joking but.... it was hard to witness. So after 4 hours of me seeing the worst in young women I had had enough an started to make the walk back to my car. On the pathway about 30 yards ahead of me I spotted something that caught my attention. I was a small girl with a sundress and hat on an there was something about the way she moved, I am not exaggerating. I couldn't see her face an she didn't have some big butt or anything like that that caught my attention.. the way she walked really struck me as feminine. I started walking fast to catch up cause I was super curious about why she struck me the way she did, it didn't take long for me to realize she had a kid and husband walking with her.. I was so focused on her movement at first that I didn't see them. Anyway they stop an look at a exhibit and I catch up to them an wouldn't you fucking believe it.... she was Russian. She was speaking to her husband in Russian (I picked up on the few Russian words I know from living in Ukraine) Some may hear this story and no think much of it. But to me its almost unbelievable that after spending 4 hours in a park witnessing the worst of the worst in young American women... that I could sense femininity just by seeing a girl 30 yards away walk .....
 
I mentioned this in at least one of the women's courtship related threads.

There have been times when I have come across women who have this feminine energy, like mentioned above. These are women I find to be below my genetic level. They are plain and don't put in any effort to turn their genetic 6 into a faux 8. Yet it's hard to not be drawn into them, in a way that is much more healthy than lusting after a girl who goes to the gym 6 times week and squeezes herself into the tightest jeans possible.

All of this has been experienced outside of the West, of course. And I think this is one reason why (mostly fake) female attractiveness has been pedestalled in the West. Women just don't have the feminine spirit, that men are also attracted to. Try explaining this to a Western normie. It makes no sense to them.

This is not something that did not exist in the West, it is something that has been destroyed. Women used to be a lot more like this:



Last year I bought a late 19th century diary written by a young English woman. It was full of airy poetry, hymns, cut outs of religious articles from Newspapers and quite a lot of ~140 year old pressed flowers. You would want to know her, just from reading it. This is the natural state for a civilised woman. People have complained about the women's nature, such as them being illogical, emotional, given to fancy, pretending the world is more like they want it to be than it is, idealism etc. These are all the right things bent into the wrong shape. To create a beautiful home, you need a woman who lives in a bit of a dream-world. Put it in politics, media, the workplace and it's clown world.
 
Cynllo said:
I mentioned this in at least one of the women's courtship related threads.

There have been times when I have come across women who have this feminine energy, like mentioned above. These are women I find to be below my genetic level. They are plain and don't put in any effort to turn their genetic 6 into a faux 8. Yet it's hard to not be drawn into them, in a way that is much more healthy than lusting after a girl who goes to the gym 6 times week and squeezes herself into the tightest jeans possible.

All of this has been experienced outside of the West, of course. And I think this is one reason why (mostly fake) female attractiveness has been pedestalled in the West. Women just don't have the feminine spirit, that men are also attracted to. Try explaining this to a Western normie. It makes no sense to them.

This is not something that did not exist in the West, it is something that has been destroyed. Women used to be a lot more like this:
Click to expand...

The more I think about it the more I realize that western women think life is like some sort of sitcom where there's a laugh track after everything they say.
That adds to being sarcastic and sassy. Sitcoms ruined a generation of women.
 
My 2 cents...

If a man can deprogram his past addictions to pornography and our cultural assumptions about love and lust he can begin to see women for what they are: his helpmeet. I can speak from experience here. I married a beautiful woman who I choose because I had lust for her. Long story short, she is not a good helpmeet. In fact, almost a reverse of that. This is not to say I am without sin and it is only the woman who has sinned. I was programmed to lust for women and then was baffled when such a woman turned out to be more of a curse than a blessing. Our lukewarm Christianity didn't make matters any better.

After a while, beauty, attractiveness, sexiness, they don't matter if your wife is a bad helpmeet. That being said, she shouldn't be someone who is vainglorious, or obsessed with how she looks to others, nor should she be gluttonous and slothful. I think if a man has dealt with those sins it is reasonable to expect to be matched with a woman who has dealt with them as well. When you are married you will often see someone at their worst and if life gets tough they may crumble.

As I continue to work on my own deprogramming the veil of lust is lifting. I see my wife differently now. Not as an object for sex but as a human partner whose responsibilities far exceed that of simple pleasures. We are supposed to be one flesh. I also see other women differently. As I fight to remove the programming of seeing them as objects I feel that I am able to see more of the real person behind the makeup and cinched waists and shapening tights. It feels almost comical, almost clown worldish to see women struggling so hard to be seen as objects. I suspect, I cannot say, I can only suspect that one's natural and God-given attraction to a woman changes the more you work on your own spiritual life. When I was picky and lust-driven I choose a woman based on a few small and foolish criteria of what I thought I wanted. I choose poorly because my choice had nothing to do with God's will (unless... unless it did? Who knows?) and everything to do with my burning need. Ironically my needs weren't even met.
 
I find that as I walk the Christian path the appeal of "hot" women who dress and act like prostitutes is falling away completely.

There is nothing to be gained from being involved with or desiring to be involved with such women. It's true that you might put off loneliness for a time, but she will not stick around, she will either push you away with her insanity or go pursuing another guy when she's bored, and you will only have wasted time you could have spent working on yourself towards finding a decent wife.

When you see it like that, the "hotties" start to lose their appeal.
 
Something that makes me notice a woman in public is when she is wearing long skirt and it isn't part an outfit that is for a formal occasion. I'm talking about a woman who chooses to wear a long skirt in the same way a typical woman would wear yoga pants. I noticed that this type of woman typically also chooses to do her makeup (if she is wearing any) in a way that isn't in the the typical sultry "hottie" Instagram ready fashion. To make it clear when I say long skirt I'm talking a lot something is all the way down the ankle. Skirts that are around knee length or shorter is still pretty common among the typical woman. For a woman to choose to wear a long skirt as casual wear when it's not really in style is an indication to me of someone who has some values that atypical from the typical modern a woman and a sign of a classical feminity.
 
thinkreadwritecode said:
My 2 cents...

If a man can deprogram his past addictions to pornography and our cultural assumptions about love and lust he can begin to see women for what they are: his helpmeet.
Click to expand...

Thank you for the reminder of why the LORD created the woman.

Recently I have been pondering about our Lord Jesus and his interactions with women; many had been following him, ministering to him, and he was visiting their homes teaching them, healing them, etc. Then I had a harsh realization: if I was placed in these same situations, my depraved mind would very quickly fall into lust/adultery. To even carry out such works with a pure conscience, would be almost too much for me to bear.
 
virtue said:
Thank you for the reminder of why the LORD created the woman.

Recently I have been pondering about our Lord Jesus and his interactions with women; many had been following him, ministering to him, and he was visiting their homes teaching them, healing them, etc. Then I had a harsh realization: if I was placed in these same situations, my depraved mind would very quickly fall into lust/adultery. To even carry out such works with a pure conscience, would be almost too much for me to bear.
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They had not only very few options, they were largely treated poorly. Life was too hard, but it may have been especially hard for a woman if she didn't have a husband or son to provide something for her. That's why the signs of raising a woman's (only) son from the dead by the prophets or Christ were especially meaningful. What we have now is full on clown world, literally women, still indirectly doing it, but actually ruling over men in many ways.

Of course, in loving them, Christ also knew how frantic and preoccupied women were (Mary's sister Martha). Don't forget also, marriage occurred in the early teens for most and there are Old Testament lessons for men not to forget the woman/bride of your youth. It's funny to say that to a modern man, as he'll either be clueless to the reality of biology and in line with clown world, or immediately aghast at how much worse it is than he thought regarding women and marriage in the modern day.
 
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There's this girl I've recently met, probably early 20s. We go to the same church. She's showing the signs that she's interested and even initiates conversations (a lot of women don't even do this), asks questions a lot, etc.

Her voice and personality are very feminine, and she's very attractive and nice to talk to. My only issue is the way she dresses. Usually a sweatshirt and jeans, never a dress or more feminine clothing (a lot of women at church wear dresses). She also doesn't put her hair down. Maybe I'm being too picky. Maybe it can be a positive that she's still attractive without trying that hard.

Curious what others think about the way women dress.
 
Douglas Quaid said:
She also doesn't put her hair down. Maybe I'm being too picky. Maybe it can be a positive that she's still attractive without trying that hard.

Curious what others think about the way women dress.
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I think if she is conservative minded and wants to be a good wife you can get basically one notch of improvement in how they dress. If all of her friends and family dress like slobs, she's not going to go from jeans and a sweatshirt to a long modest dress with a headcovering in church, let alone for her streetwear. I would reasonably expect her to go from jeans and sweatshirt to jeans and a nice blouse, or a mid length skirt and a decent t-shirt. I would not expect her to dress like a trad wife. Her current dress in church is just too far from that, albeit much better than wearing a miniskirt or leggings to church, which is often seen.

DO NOT expect her to change for you. If it happens it happens in a small dose over years, and there's probably going to be conflict leading up to it.

DO NOT underestimate the influence of a woman's friends and family over her. In this day and age, it will be greater than your influence over her nine times out of ten. You marry your wife's parents plus her friends. Find out who those people are.

This is not the same sociopolitical situation that existed when the Church Fathers wrote the Bible and subsequent works. Women have far more power in a marriage, legally, than the husband. Women often, depending on the state, will have sole authority in naming their children and putting down who the legal father is on the birth certificate. If there is a domestic dispute in either direction, you as the man are going to be kicked out by the police. In a divorce, barring obvious drug use, you will lose out on custody, and even then you will almost certainly lose your house, if not also your car and half of all your other assets. I've seen it happen. Due to this reality, you cannot expect to have much influence over your wife. She has the full backing of the state behind her, and her family. You as the man won't even have the backing of your own family most likely.

So be very cautious and selective. The person you marry is the person you marry, and you can't legally make them do anything.
 
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The key factor is, as a potential wife, how interested is she to respect your viewpoint and please you, so to speak. By that I mean, you ordering her to dress a certain way wouldn't work in any case, but if she respects you and wants to live within your frame, as you get to know each other better, you could guide her by praising modesty and femininity, and pointing out how other women dress sluttily or like frumpy men and how gross/unappealing it is. If she's of the right mindset then she will pick up on that and make adjustments. This happened with my wife, she used to follow fashion trends and show midriff all the time but she over time came to adjust her tastes with my guidance without me ever needing to tell her what or what not to wear.
 
Douglas Quaid said:
There's this girl I've recently met, probably early 20s. We go to the same church. She's showing the signs that she's interested and even initiates conversations (a lot of women don't even do this), asks questions a lot, etc.

Her voice and personality are very feminine, and she's very attractive and nice to talk to. My only issue is the way she dresses. Usually a sweatshirt and jeans, never a dress or more feminine clothing (a lot of women at church wear dresses). She also doesn't put her hair down. Maybe I'm being too picky. Maybe it can be a positive that she's still attractive without trying that hard.

Curious what others think about the way women dress.
Click to expand...
I'm a big appreciator of women dressing in a feminine manner as can be seen with my comments in this thread but the way the culture is, just merely being modest and avoiding a lot of the yellow/red flags like blue/purple/rainbow hair, facial piercings, big tattoos, and such is already enough to pass my tests. Anything beyond that I just see as a bonus.
 
Wutang said:
I'm a big appreciator of women dressing in a feminine manner as can be seen with my comments in this thread but the way the culture is, just merely being modest and avoiding a lot of the yellow/red flags like blue/purple/rainbow hair, facial piercings, big tattoos, and such is already enough to pass my tests. Anything beyond that I just see as a bonus.
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Right, I realize my post may have sounded like a hard "No" to this lady, but that's not the case. Sweatshirts are modest, and pants are a lot more modest than what many women wear nowadays. Sounds like her attire is modest yet still is acceptable by the world.
 
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