Moving to Montenegro

[Tippy]

Hi all,

I have an opportunity to move to Montenegro and live and work there as a teacher.

To be honest, I'm not sure since I lived in Albania last year and was miserable and didn't enjoy Poland either. To be honest, 'escaping the collapse' has led me to trade off one set of problems for another.

I'm just posting to let you know that although as an international teacher I get many offers, I also dont like teaching much. It's very consuming and stressful. Ultimately, it matters less and less the exoticism of the location if the job takes over your life and mental bandwidth.

At the same time, it's a lot of money. Obviously women are better. Just not sure I won't hate it.

If I stay in uk I can do supply teaching or temp work and maybe have some balance but I have to live at home with family (which carries it's own set of problems).

I'm posting this for some advice.

Cheers!

 

[Australia Sucks]

To be honest, I'm not sure since I lived in Albania last year and was miserable and didn't enjoy Poland either. To be honest, 'escaping the collapse' has led me to trade off one set of problems for another.

As I have mentioned before there is a reason the old saying exists “there are no solutions only trade offs”. The goal is to trade off your problems for a better set of problems. There is no perfect place or perfect person etc.

 

[Australia Sucks]

Ultimately, it matters less and less the exoticism of the location if the job takes over your life and mental bandwidth.

In general working sucks for 99% of people. Do you have a plan for financial freedom/early retirement? (or as it’s sometimes referred to as FIRE (financial independence retire early).

I'm posting this for some advice.

You need to have goals around savings and investments so you can retire early and enjoy life at some point. Working until old age is miserable and depressing for most people. Most jobs are soul sucking.

 

[Tippy]

Hey man. No I don't. I'm a career teacher mercenary type who can be employed anywhere. But it's not freedom. It's just slavery to usually a school's demands.

 

[Australia Sucks]

Hey man. No I don't. I'm a career teacher mercenary type who can be employed anywhere. But it's not freedom. It's just slavery to usually a school's demands.

Well then you already know what the problem is and what you should be doing to resolve it.

 

[Pravoslavac]

Hi all,

I have an opportunity to move to Montenegro and live and work there as a teacher.

I wouldn't think twice especially if the money's good. You won't have to wait long before the topography and local style of living wins you over. This is much better than Albania.

 

[Australia Sucks]

I wouldn't think twice especially if the money's good. You won't have to wait long before the topography and local style of living wins you over. This is much better than Albania.

The downside of Montenegro is that cost of living keeps rising as increasing tourism and gentrification keeps pushing the price level up. Still not an expensive country yet but it is heading in that direction.

 

[Pravoslavac]

The downside of Montenegro is that cost of living keeps rising as increasing tourism and gentrification keeps pushing the price level up. Still not an expensive country yet but it is heading in that direction.

Avoid towns like Kotor and Budva where tourists congregate. Anywhere else groceries are as reasonably priced as anywhere in the Balkans. Sometimes going one street further makes the difference.

 

[Tippy]

Avoid towns like Kotor and Budva where tourists congregate. Anywhere else groceries are as reasonably priced as anywhere in the Balkans. Sometimes going one street further makes the difference.

Where are you based now if you don't mind me asking?

 

[jayco]

The downside of Montenegro is that cost of living keeps rising as increasing tourism and gentrification keeps pushing the price level up. Still not an expensive country yet but it is heading in that direction.

Yes, I had considered moving there a few years ago but had guessed the general direction things would be heading, with increasing popularity of worldwide tourism driven by influencers and high COL in Western countries. Figured it would be a matter of time before Montenegro is fully "discovered". Population density already being high there, by my standards, tourism will increase the crowds and prices, and bring gentrification, which will be followed by resentment towards foreigners. So I decided that a piece of Adriatic paradise with mild climate wasn't worth the trouble of learning the language and major cultural adjustment only to relocate again.

 

[FrostBITE]

Seems like a nice country.

Montenegro suspends visa-free regime with Turkey after violence

Montenegro temporarily suspended a visa-free regime for Turkish nationals on Monday following a weekend of violence triggered by the stabbing of a Montenegrin man in the capital Podgorica by a group of Turks.

www.reuters.com

 

[analyst_green]

Yes, I had considered moving there a few years ago but had guessed the general direction things would be heading, with increasing popularity of worldwide tourism driven by influencers and high COL in Western countries. Figured it would be a matter of time before Montenegro is fully "discovered". Population density already being high there, by my standards, tourism will increase the crowds and prices, and bring gentrification, which will be followed by resentment towards foreigners. So I decided that a piece of Adriatic paradise with mild climate wasn't worth the trouble of learning the language and major cultural adjustment only to relocate again.

Places that are beautiful and have a mild climate have started pulling in a lot of transplants. Especially after COVID and the rise of remote work. The US has the same problem with many Southeastern and mountain states getting swamped.

If you want low COL you have to go somewhere cold and/or boring. Like Minsk maybe.

 

[jayco]

Places that are beautiful and have a mild climate have started pulling in a lot of transplants. Especially after COVID and the rise of remote work. The US has the same problem with many Southeastern and mountain states getting swamped.

If you want low COL you have to go somewhere cold and/or boring. Like Minsk maybe.

Yes, exactly, cold, boring and preferably scary and "totalitarian" too , but I question how much all of this can keep deterring those as soon as there is a carrot of low COL. Even Belarus has too many expats now, though at least those are mostly native Russian speakers and aren't wealthy. True, and the same process had happened inside the US, Latin America and even Russia, in scenic warmer regions

 

[OrthoSerb]

Seems like a nice country.

Montenegro suspends visa-free regime with Turkey after violence

Montenegro temporarily suspended a visa-free regime for Turkish nationals on Monday following a weekend of violence triggered by the stabbing of a Montenegrin man in the capital Podgorica by a group of Turks.

www.reuters.com

Turkish Foreign Minister Hakan Fidan spoke with Montenegro's Prime Minister Milojko Spajic and Foreign Minister Ervin Ibrahimovic by phone on Monday. He said Ankara expected Montenegrin authorities to take necessary measures to ensure the safety and rights of Turkish citizens, a Turkish foreign ministry source said.

How about deporting them back to Turkey, that'll protect their safety and rights?

"Montenegro fully takes into account the interests and status of approximately 14,000 citizens of the Republic of Turkey who are on its territory, and will take all necessary steps to ensure that their stay is unhindered and in accordance with the law," it said.

What are 14,000 Turks doing in Montenegro, it only has a population of 500,000? They should have no interests or status in Montenegro. They tried to occupy the land for more than half a millenia and now they have "interests" and "status"?

It will provide an accelerated visa issuance procedure for all Turkish nationals who plan to arrive, stay or transit through Montenegro to minimise disruption, the statement said.

Lunacy. It's not enough to vote such leadership out, they need to be made an example of. There should be laws passed in European countries to retrospectively imprison for life those that have contributed to the demographic transformation of their countries and the dispossession of their people. And contrary to Tucker's latest emphasis on collective punishment being immoral, I don't see it that way. These people do what they do partly to benefit their extended family economically. Its not enough to punish just the one engaged in the corruption, the entire family needs to be stripped of its financial assets and banned from participating in the political system. There's no significant disincentive at the moment, theres no sense of shame or fear.

 

[Tippy]

Yes, I had considered moving there a few years ago but had guessed the general direction things would be heading, with increasing popularity of worldwide tourism driven by influencers and high COL in Western countries. Figured it would be a matter of time before Montenegro is fully "discovered". Population density already being high there, by my standards, tourism will increase the crowds and prices, and bring gentrification, which will be followed by resentment towards foreigners. So I decided that a piece of Adriatic paradise with mild climate wasn't worth the trouble of learning the language and major cultural adjustment only to relocate again.

Yeah but that will take a while like 20 years. It's not an unreasonable decision you made but I don't think your reasons fully make sense.

 

[FrostBITE]

How about deporting them back to Turkey, that'll protect their safety and rights?

What are 14,000 Turks doing in Montenegro, it only has a population of 500,000? They should have no interests or status in Montenegro. They tried to occupy the land for more than half a millenia and now they have "interests" and "status"?

Lunacy. It's not enough to vote such leadership out, they need to be made an example of. There should be laws passed in European countries to retrospectively imprison for life those that have contributed to the demographic transformation of their countries and the dispossession of their people. And contrary to Tucker's latest emphasis on collective punishment being immoral, I don't see it that way. These people do what they do partly to benefit their extended family economically. Its not enough to punish just the one engaged in the corruption, the entire family needs to be stripped of its financial assets and banned from participating in the political system. There's no significant disincentive at the moment, theres no sense of shame or fear.

After the collapse of socialism in Eastern Europe, Turks cleverly increased soft power in the newly independent (read: poor, desperate, and often wartorn) states. They opened up schools, established cultural organizations, and, naturally, constructed and/or funded mosques. The objective was of course to foster a generation of potential or future statesmen or bigwigs with natural ties to or affinity for Turkey (modern janissaries?).

Turkey regards itself as the heir of the Ottoman Empire and stresses its claim to regional power. This claim goes beyond religion, as Rebecca Byrant, an expert in cultural anthropology at Utrecht University, explained. According to her, funding the construction of mosques is just one element of Turkish infrastructure policy, not only in the Western Balkans, but also in the Caucasus, Central Asia, North Africa and sub-Saharan Africa. The construction of mosques must therefore to be viewed in a wider geopolitical context, the expert said. … Whether railroad lines, ports, hotels or shopping districts: Turkish investors are on the move in a big way from Sarajevo in Bosnia and Herzegovina, to Batumi in Georgia, from Astana, the capital of Kazakhstan, to Turkish-occupied northern Cyprus and Senegal.

Turkey ramps up political influence in the Western Balkans – DW – 07/06/2025

Turkey hopes to expand its influence by investing in infrastructure and religious landmark buildings across the Western Balkans. Building mosques are part and parcel of Ankara's geopolitical agenda, observers say.

www.dw.com

 

[jayco]

I had checked some numbers, didn't realize how popular Balkans had become as a tourist destination, wow. Montenegro receives about 500 foreign tourists per square mile per year, Albania mind blowing 1000 tourists per mile, while Australia only gets 2.8 tourists per sq. mile per year! Talk about putting things into context. Even USA, very big tourist destination, gets "only" 20 foriegn tourists per sq. mile over a year. Of course, tourists tend to get concentrated in certain popular areas, but I find that it always spreads around, eventually. Popular areas of the US certainly feel like thousands of tourists per square mile, not even counting huge domestic tourism, and the crowds and high real estate prices always spread around, first it's 20 miles radius, then 100, then 200. Belarus tourist visitation seems to be huge these days too, 100 foreign tourists per sq mile per year! Still 10 times less than Albania but 34 times more than Australia

 

[analyst_green]

I had checked some numbers, didn't realize how popular Balkans had become as a tourist destination, wow. Montenegro receives about 500 foreign tourists per square mile per year, Albania mind blowing 1000 tourists per mile, while Australia only gets 2.8 tourists per sq. mile per year! Talk about putting things into context. Even USA, very big tourist destination, gets "only" 20 foriegn tourists per sq. mile over a year. Of course, tourists tend to get concentrated in certain popular areas, but I find that it always spreads around, eventually. Popular areas of the US certainly feel like thousands of tourists per square mile, not even counting huge domestic tourism, and the crowds and high real estate prices always spread around, first it's 20 miles radius, then 100, then 200. Belarus tourist visitation seems to be huge these days too, 100 foreign tourists per sq mile per year! Still 10 times less than Albania but 34 times more than Australia

I would tourists per capita or the tourist per local ratio as a better measure. Much of Australia is uninhabited, inaccessible desert.

Montenegro has a tourist to local ratio of 4.1 which is one of the highest in the world. Australia has a local to tourist ratio of 3.6, so if you convert that to tourist to local it is 0.28. So Montenegro has about 15 times as many tourists per local as Australia, still very impressive.

 

[jayco]

I would tourists per capita or the tourist per local ratio as a better measure.

Yes. Here is another map of tourist visits per 1000 locals. Almost entire US and Southern Canada are heavy in that department

From this study

https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/00472875211051418

Much of Australia is uninhabited, inaccessible desert.

Which is very good stuff. Given sunny, warm climate it could be getting packed like Arizona now

Montenegro has a tourist to local ratio of 4.1 which is one of the highest in the world.

Australia has a local to tourist ratio of 3.6, so if you convert that to tourist to local it is 0.28. So Montenegro has about 15 times as many tourists per local as Australia, still very impressive.

Yes, pretty crazy that Montenegro is one of the highest. Albania is higher than Greece even, and Greece is packed! In Australia tourusts are concentrated along the population centers, where ratios per local get high, but inland should have some extremely low tourism ratios. Terra incognita

Interesting. Canada probably gets such high ratio becuse of American tourists to National Parks, not sure

 

[Pravoslavac]

Yes, pretty crazy that Montenegro is one of the highest. Albania is higher than Greece even, and Greece is packed!

Bear in mind that it's only packed July and August. Those months are the plague. May and September is a drop to 10-25% max.