If God real why bad thing happen

scary_robot_music

scary_robot_music

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I've never been one to doubt God's existence because of all the horrible things that happen in the world. I grew up very religious and eventually became an agnostic for a time, but for completely different reasons.

Lately on a lot of other forums on online venues I've run into a lot of atheists who will tell a story of something terrible, say a woman kidnapped and repeatedly raped while praying to be saved the whole time, but nothing. The cops eventually rescue her after a few weeks but she's broken and traumatized for life. Then the atheist says:

WHERE WERE GOD AND JESUS, CHRISTIANS????!!!! HAHAHA. CHECKMATE!

As if he's the first person to ever ask "If God real why bad thing happen"? It seems so childish, yet a lot of people think this way.

Since finding my faith again, my answer to this dilema has always been "I don't know, but God is real." I found this meme:

ifgodreal.jpg

It's pretty good, but I don't think it would do much to convince anyone who might be on the fence about the existence of God in a debate between a believer and an atheist about the existence of God.

Does anyone have anything better? I mean something a bit less cerebral that might appeal more to the masses.
 
considering that all atheists are homosexual (and this comes with a whole slew of negative traits), their notion of good and evil is quite warped from reality. for instance, the fact that there are consequences if you engage in endless anal intercourse is proof enough of a godless universe. rather than get frustrated, just bear in mind that you will be trying to establish rational discourse with someone whose political and ideological leanings are all out of whack with reality.
 
There's a meme I saw but can't find it now. A man is in the desert dying of thirst. He sees water on flat ground in the distance but it is a mirage. On the other side he sees tall mountains and obstacles, and God is telling him to go there. There is water there but it is hidden behind the mountains. He refuses to follow God's plan and goes towards the easy to reach mirage instead.

I thought it perfectly illustrated that God sees our future, He sees what will most benefit us later on even if we must suffer today. And most people are not willing to struggle for Him even a bit.
 
scary_robot_music said:
Since finding my faith again, my answer to this dilema has always been "I don't know, but God is real." I found this meme:

ifgodreal.jpg


It's pretty good, but I don't think it would do much to convince anyone who might be on the fence about the existence of God in a debate between a believer and an atheist about the existence of God.
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This meme is the Biblical answer. God allows bad things to happen so that He may bring a greater good out of the bad situation. He accomplishes demonstrations of both His Just Wrath against sin and His Mercy toward sinners. Whether the atheist accepts that or not doesn't really matter, it's the truth. In fact, the Bible says that he will reject it because He is already rejecting God.

The alternative answer to this is God allows bad things to happen because free will. While this is true in a limited sense, it is not absolutely true. If God always allows evil free will choices and never puts a stop to them then He is the Deist God, He just doesn't care.
 
The problem with bad things is only a concern for those who don't believe in God- there will be no remedy, ever, nobody will be made whole. All the many human caused bad things will also go unpunished, future generations may suffer from what they had nothing to do with, and nothing will save them at that moment or in the future.

If the atheists want to know the Christian perspective they must look at the whole system. We had been given a perfect world without bad things and we lost it by letting evil in. Now, God is good and merciful and he allows only a limited amount- much less than what we have brought/are bringing upon ourselves- of evil to afflict us, knowing what we can bear. Everything we deserve- all that we've stirred up- could crush us.

But all of that is finite and limited, even if a whole life is a long series of suffering, death will bring a stop to it. Recall how much our Lord and God Jesus himself had to suffer, and he didn't have to. This is the goodness of God.

Then imagine you're looking at your life from your place in Heaven- how insignificant, how infinitely small everything bad you went through will seem, maybe you'll have no memory of any of that at all. In Hell you might be tormented by amplified, horrible memories I suppose.

The only thing that will matter will be how close you got to living your life according to God's will, that will be your treasure, how you adhered to his commandments. The glory of God, the eternal life, the joy and happiness, all that goodness and beauty that exceeds our imagination is infinite and will last forever.

Going back to ninth grade now- even if the sum of all the bad things that came your way adds up to some terribly large numerical value, it is a finite number after all. That number over infinity is zero. The bad things we had gone through will have no significance.

That's our future, we don't have to guess if things may improve or not. What are atheists going to do when the going gets tough and there is no hope, with even worse things on the horizon, kill themselves? What is their reason for living?

Making it to Heaven is all that matters, like St.Paul- stay in this good fight, keep the faith, and finish the race.


If atheists accept our belief in God they must accept we also believe God didn't promise us a world without bad things here after Eden.

The Bible says life will be though, there will be pain.

But this is not our world any more, we have a way out, and there are no bad things happening in Heaven.
 
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The universe is built on cause and effect. You might get hit by a car and die from blunt trauma. Just how it works. As you progress through life you will hit bumps in the road; abuse, pain, hopelessness, limitations, regrets, injustice, lost time, mistakes, etc. These things wear down your spirit like progressive age wears down your body. They also have a compounding effect on the urge to become depraved. The level of submission you have towards God determines whether those things are successful in extinguishing your soul. It works from a agnostic perspective as well. To make it super simple, agnostic friendly, it's about dying when the time comes with honor, standing on your feet, not on your knees. That's how I perceive it. Nothing to do with God being your babysitter.
 
Part of the answer is that the resurrection and the eternal Kingdom of God will make the trials of this life fade into insignificance. No more sorrow, no more pain, every tear will be dried.

Eye has not seen, ear has not heard, nor has it entered into the mind of men what God has prepared for those who love him. All things work together for good to those who love God, and are called according to his purpose.

The pain of this world, and even the greatest blessings of this world pale in comparison to our inheritance in Christ.
 
NSOE said:
The problem with bad things is only a concern for those who don't believe in God- there will be no remedy, ever, nobody will be made whole.
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Yes, one of the best responses that teaches the point is also the question, "If God doesn't exist, why do bad things happen?"
NSOE said:
But all of that is finite and limited, even if a whole life is a long series of suffering, death will bring a stop to it. Recall how much our Lord and God Jesus himself had to suffer, and he didn't have to. This is the goodness of God.
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It surprises me the most, and sadly so, that Christians get lost in the secular world and forget the teaching that is the most clear "If it happened to me, it'll happen to you" - a student is not above his master. The proof, in my view, that Christ is God and that human suffering matters is that He participates in everything we go through, overcomes it all (and without sin!), and does this all willingly. I've always called this the ultimate skin in the game, since no human believes in others that talk but don't act. He is precisely what every man is looking for: integrity, honor, love, and most importantly, the one who defeats the last enemy, death.
 
Caduceus said:
I'm no fan of godless atheists or sodomizing faggots, but this statement is just false.
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Thanks for saying this. The only way in which that statement is even close to true is that most atheists are in political and social circles where, if not homosexuals themselves, they're at least obliged to express sufficient enthusiasm about homosexuality and all its permutations like transsexuality. Then again, you could probably say the same about most mainstream Christians nowadays.
 
Blade Runner said:
Yes, one of the best responses that teaches the point is also the question, "If God doesn't exist, why do bad things happen?"
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And it should be sufficient to disarm the atheists who try to attach God to bad occurrences. Their view is illogical but they're too prideful to see.

I can't blame God for any bad thing since I'm not a believer, but because you are, I will. Why is the world the way it is, if your God is good- we were once given a paradise, and we'll have it again, bit since you don't believe in God your question makes no sense.

Where does their notion of good vs bad come from? We know that it's not an issue hinging on relativism, which it would be without God.
In Pre-Christian times people knew that God is the highest good, and the true source of all morality, we have the book of Genesis where God says his creation is good.

Reading through all the responses, a meme to counter the thread title could be something like:

If good God real and bad thing happen, then good God not real.

Since there no God (anchor of all morality), when bad thing happen to you, bad thing not bad.

It all very good you hurt, dead, and annihilated, very good for animal and planet.


The very existence of the world proves God is real, and that He is good, since goodness dominates and decisively dwarfs evil, which would otherwise bring destruction/annihilation. It almost seems like God had to create the fallen-angel-proof Hell, for the demons to be confined to, since without the smallest shred of good will, they'd cause it to collapse into nothingness.

How do atheists imagine a world without God? Who told them their very own existence, or that of the universe is good? Why? Because they can have a little bit of a good time for a while? OK then, so rape is good for the rapist but bad for his victim, who gets to be the arbiter- oh but it destroys social cohesion, but unless it affects the majority, it really doesn't, life will go on uninterrupted for most not directly involved.

So maybe because of the consensus the majority reached? Then in a society of ten people who are self reliant and don't leech off of one another, if nine agree to take/steal everything from the individual standing alone, and it's good and beneficial for them, everything would be good, their victim be damned. If evolution were true, this is how it could be- everything is good if it's to your advantage, if you can get away with it.

We live in a might makes right world on the macro level. I think it would be good for my life, if certain people got killed, but in interpersonal relations people feel something is off if they wrong someone- if God's grace is upon them- including non Christians.

Theologians have said since forever, how nothing makes sense without God.


Blade Runner said:
The proof, in my view, that Christ is God and that human suffering matters is that He participates in everything we go through, overcomes it all (and without sin!), and does this all willingly. I've always called this the ultimate skin in the game, since no human believes in others that talk but don't act. He is precisely what every man is looking for: integrity, honor, love, and most importantly, the one who defeats the last enemy, death.
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Yes, God wouldn't be good if he hadn't done that for us. We are just dust compared to His infinite greatness, and yet in his unbound goodness he went through hell for wretches like us. Atheists don't have a point trying to prove He's bad, and therefore non existent.

Like Thomas said above, Jesus through his Resurrection nullifies everything that's bad, if we only accept Him and take advantage of His sacrifice. If not, everybody will have to take rightful ownership of all the evil originated through his actions, and take it with him to Hell. Where all the unredeemed bad things return to sinners, and stay with them for eternity.
 
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NSOE said:
Their argument is such a strawman. Genesis, the first book of the Bible explains why at the very beginning.
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An atheist believes it's cruel to be made to suffer, indirectly acknowledging the loving nature of God. Given the unfathomable proposition of God hurting us the atheist chooses to believe in a random universe, indirectly acknowledging that our reality is marked by a separation from God. The atheist finds comfort in believing that only the tangible can alleviate suffering, recommitting the original sin, doomed to seek the absence of suffering in the temporary and the fleeting. In end the suffering and death the atheist experiences ends up not so random but by his own design.
 
starlight said:
"If no God, why good happen?"
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"Because I made it happen by myself."

Christians go through a process of deeper understanding, usually up to a point, and this is one of those questions that we like to contemplate. However, for people who don't want to listen to God, there is no point in engaging with them when they employ reddit tier framing. They are not listening. They are not ready. I would certainly pray for someone like this, but I wouldn't waste my time talking to them with any kind of direct answer.

Try a parable. That's about it. They'll change their question's focus to something better when they're ready to listen to God. Arguing with them just fuels their delusion of self-reliance.
 
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